Battleship loads

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 12:36 am

MLV re. Ft. Mifflin :

“Fort Mifflin was built beginning in 1772 and originally called Fort Island Battery, also known as Mud Island Fort until construction was finished in 1777….Fort Mifflin was used as a military prison during the Civil War. It was dismantled in 1904 but was restored from the original plans in 1930. The site had then been used as a Naval Ammunitions Depot, until transferred to the state. The marsh islands around the area were filled in to build the airport and interstate highway 95. No trace remains of Fort Gaines or the 1777 British seige batteries. “

I would imagine that ships entering/leaving the Philadelphia Naval Yard, loaded/off loaded munitions there.

Read all ‘bout it:
http://www.geocities.com/delbayforts/Fort_Mifflin/

Texas Shooter · Post by **Texas Shooter** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 12:41 am

Ray:

You are right, "Process", is an important word. Given that they are MIL spec'd, I wonder if the "process" involves packaging issues rather than chemical ones.

I would like to know.

Texas Shooter

LJBass · Post by **LJBass** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 1:07 am

Omak and Howard,
If you guys can get yourselves organized, you can make the first 500 yd target rifle match of the year at Machias. Show up time is 8 AM January 3rd. The match will be a 30 round any position match, shot in 3 ten round strings with unlimited sighters and a 20 minute per string time limit. Hope to see you there.
LJ
PS. If you need directions let me know.

Omak Cowboy · Post by **Omak Cowboy** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 9:22 am

LJ, Thank you for the kind offer. I'm still hip deep in paint, drywall, granite or marble - can't make up my mind on that one..and sordid other materials in the bath remodel job.

Still haven't fired a round from the rifle...no damn time.

Maybe Feb?

Happy New Year, all

Omak

Howard Haworth · Post by **Howard Haworth** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 9:55 am

LJBrass,
If every thing works out right I plan to be there on the third. I only made one shoot last year and plan on doing much better at attending those shoots. Had a blast at the one I did make a great group of guys. Howard

P.S. Could you send me the directions? Thanks

Bearbait2 · Post by **Bearbait2** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 11:41 am

In the early 80's, the US Navy (at Dahlgren) was working on a long range 16" projectile, 50 to 75 miles effective range. It was my understanding the Fleet Guns were still using black powder. The powder charges I had a chance to observe were identified as black powder, to me. Don't know of anyother ordinance being used in VietNam that did so; based on personal experience (but I didn't see everything, to say the least).
Shoot Straight

Texas Shooter · Post by **Texas Shooter** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:04 pm

Bearbait2:

Maybe in those big guns, smokeless or something else more efficient, would just be too much of a good thing. Ka-Boom!!

Texas Shooter

RichBratlee · Post by **RichBratlee** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 5:26 pm

Hey guys FWIW--I had a couple of buddies who transfered over to the BB's whne they first brought them out of moth balls back in the 80's--from what they were saying the 16" 50's used a 110 pound BP ignition charge and the main propellants were different compositions of nitro cellulose---depending on type of projectile, range needed and what effect you needed upon contact you used different combinations of the propellants!!--This is also one theory of what caused the gun to blow on The Iowa---they were experimenting and ignored a warning about useing certain propellants together

Rich

Omak Cowboy · Post by **Omak Cowboy** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:23 pm

Rich writes: they were experimenting and ignored a warning about useing certain propellants together

JESUS FROG!! They were experimenting??? The ships were built 50 years earlier - so 50 years of practicle knowledge and some idiot felt he had to "experiment"???

Good Grief!
Omak

Omaha Poke · Post by **Omaha Poke** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:45 pm

Guys, I would like to get a gander at the guy who had to push the cleaning rod through those big barrels

All fooling aside, my father in law was on a battle ship during WWII, and I am the only person he will ever talk about his experiences with. How the hell did they clean those big barrels

I am going to see him tomorrow, and ask him. I will let you all know.

Randy

Mike Hansen · Post by **Mike Hansen** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 8:53 pm

[quote="Omak Cowboy"]On a previous post there was a question on how the main guns on battleships are loaded...[/quote]

For everything you always wanted to know about IOWA class battleships, go to:

http://www.warships1.com/US/BB61stats/index.htm

Mike (former USN E6 and "Trusty, Crusty Shellback" aboard USS RANGER CV-61)

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 11:37 pm

“Igniter or Igniter Patch - Bag ammunition charges have a small patch at one or both ends containing black powder (gunpowder). This is used to set off the main propellant charge. See "primer," below.”

***

“Propellants - An overview of some of the most common propellants used by naval guns since the 1880s.

 Black Powder - Commonly known as "gunpowder," this was obsolete by the 1880s and rarely used after 1900 by the major powers.

 Brown or Cocoa Powder - Propellant developed in the late 19th century. Brown powder is similar to black powder (gunpowder), each being a mixture of potassium nitrate, charcoal and sulfur, but brown powder has a lower sulfur content (3% versus 12%) and a correspondingly higher potassium nitrate content. The reduced sulfur content results in a slower rate of deflagration (burning) and the higher potassium nitrate content supports a more complete burning of the charcoal and thus releases more energy. The slower burning nature of brown powder allowed longer barrel lengths and thus higher muzzle velocities.”

***

“Nitrocellulose - Explosive substance formed by the nitration of cotton or some other form of cellulose. Used as the base of most USN propellants. During World War II, the USN used mostly a multi-tube form, made up of 99.5% NC (12.6% N), 0.5% diphenylamine and the short grain usually had seven perforations with the websize varying from 0.023 in (0.58 mm) for the short 3 in (7.62 cm) gun to about 0.174 in (4.42 mm) for the 16 in (40.6 cm) guns. The USN's propellants had a good safety record partly due to the harder-to-ignite and slow burning nature of their nitrocellulose propellants and partly due to the quality of their manufacturing process.”

Read all ‘bout it:
http://www.warships1.com/Weapons/Gun_Da ... efinitions

Texas Shooter · Post by **Texas Shooter** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 12:24 am

Ray:

Thanks for digging that up. Excellent information. That whole page was interesting to read.

Texas Shooter

Woodcutter · Post by **Woodcutter** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 6:18 am

Ray Newman:
If you have ever seen footage of those 16 inch guns being fired, there is no way the eruption of smoke and flame would not be seen! Also of interest is that compressed air is used to clear the bore immediately after firing the guns on the Iowa -class battleships. This may be observed in live film footage .

Woodcutter · Post by **Woodcutter** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 6:29 am

http://www.bb62museum.org/images/bb62firing5.jpg

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