Shiloh Rifle Forums

Not sure, I use the Lee handles.

I ran a test and jammed one of the rounds that I made into the Sharps. It does go in using the persuader lever tool. The extractor can't remove it, but the cleaning rod and a light tap forces it back off the lands OK. The bullet is marked by the lands, with good sized troughs cut into the lead back from the shoulder of the round to about 0.15" from the case mouth.

Can I fire these as "practice" rounds or should I pull the bullets and re-cast everything I made using the Lyman mold?

You have found that they won't be ideal, just Lyman. As long as you have gotten this far with them use them to learn. You could find that they shoot well, lot of guys on here shoot ammo they have to lever in and like it. I don't think I would cast anymore until you find out your results on that. I like the concept myself of.making ammo that fits in my chamber without forcing it. It is your decision to try them or not, if you quit on them you won't know and that in my mind is of less benefit for all your work than atleast trying them. Good luck. Bobw

They aren't dangerous to use with black powder loads, just a nuisance.

One question is how did you seat your bullets. Just slip fit or did you seat them with a die.
If you tried compression with a die you will expand soft bullets.

He's using a compression die. These molds are known for wild variations in nose diameter with recent production.

Yeah not just recent production. They been on and off for 30 years for bp bullets.
Before buying another Mike the cast bullet prior to seating in the case. It dont take much to bump a nose.

Doug I'd just get yourself a Buffalo Arms mold. You'll find that all of the regular mass production molds are a crap shoot. If you buy another one it'll just be a second mold that you end up selling at a loss before you buy that BACO mold.

Even the latest Saeco molds aren't perfect. I have a recent Saeco #740 that casts at 0.461" with a 0.450" nose which is a little bigger than what most would want.

There are any number of BACO molds that will make bullets that your Shiloh likes, and a few that it might not. Mostly I shoot Money bullets.

The 458535M1 has worked well in almost all of my 45 cal rifles, with the exception of one of my 45-70 Shilohs.
The 459540M3 or 459543M3 bullets are great long range bullets in my 45-90's
My Shiloh 45-70 rifles allow a .460" bullet to be slip fit so I've been using the 460535M5

I have had a couple that I'm not fond of.
459535M1. Despite the number being the same as the 458535M1 except for the diameter, the 459 bullet is different, and has a fat nose that has caused me leading problems.

I'm undecided on the 459530M4. I won a gong match with it once in an older Shiloh that had a tighter than normal bore that allowed this bullet to center very well. It hasn't really done as well as the other bullets for me but I keep it around just in case

If you call BACO, you can probably get Dave on the phone and tell him what you are looking for and he'll make you a solid recommendation. Or ask Zack here on the forum. He has given me lots of advice and it's all been good.

Chris.

The trouble with grease groove molds is very seldom do you get what you want exactly in results. Which leads you down the rabbit hole of being a mold of the month club member. Maybe that is good, I don't think so.. but it sure can be expensive. Back in 2011 I bought a KAL tool 45 tgbs mold .442" diameter. In 2015 I made a road trip up to shiloh and bought a gun library MR in 45-70. Been using that same mold ever since, it's adjustable so I can tune for length and weight change. With the money some of these guys on here spend on new greaser molds every month over the last 7 years I have been able to buy 2 more shilohs. My loads hold tighter than I can. I also don't piss away money on a new mold every time I don't get a one hole group. Every one here needs a good mold but also need to understand their personal capabilities may not be as good as their existing equipment. Best of luck bobw

.. Another reality check from Bob !

" Every one here needs a good mold but also need to understand their personal capabilities may not be as good as their existing equipment."

As a fully paid up ( & very much still current ) member of the M.O.T.M. club , I would have to agree whole heartedly with the above statement. That said I've also been chasing the Holy Grail with regard bullet design. Weight vs length vs profile. GG/ PP.. etc etc. The more recent Lyman 'Postel' #457132 was my initial foray into shooting the 45/110 and I was fortunate to get a good example but invariably, results down range were based upon the 'nut on the butt'. A good mould is cheap insurance in the long run and they are generally easier to cast with ( symmetrical/ dropping well etc ). Bullet length vs twist is definitely worth considering though if you have a slower twist than the current 1/18" standard. A 1/16" clearly gives you some latitude but the 1/20"..not so much. One of our clubs better shooters, shoots paper patch and has an earlier 1/20" Shiloh. He shortened his mould to produce a bullet which hovers around 495/500 grains. It doesnt appear to be much of a reduction but the drop in length produced the goods. BACo, Accurate, Brooks, Kal, etc that's where I'd be spending my money these days. There arent many designs that havent been tried and you'll likely find one that suits. I'm not the first to try and reinvent the wheel
regards.. J.B.

I checked that I'm not fattening up the bullets while assembling the cartridge. I'm compressing 68 grains of 1.5F Swiss down to 0.630" from the top of the case using the compression die, and the bullets slide in with almost no force on the handle. Also, I measured assembled and non-assembled bullets - same size. I did test one to see what would happen if I compressed the powder using a bullet - it leaves a deep impression in a ring around the nose, and the shoulder fattens up an additional 0.004".

I ordered the Saeco mold from Midway and it shipped before the BACO mold advice was posted. I don't think I have a means to measure the mold without casting something, and I don't like the idea of doing a casting and then sending it back (feels bad). Any ideas on how to do this?

Call steve Brooks of Brooks Moulds -- 406-782-5114 -- and discuss a mould with him. Then have a chamber cast done, next send the chamber cast and mould description/number off to Brooks and have him lathe cut a mould to fit your rifle's chamber/throat. Have the chamber cast done so it is up into rifling about 1". Buy some cerrosafe and you can do the chamber cast yourself. It is not that difficult. Believe Midway and probably other sites sell it.

Not exactly inexpensive, but in the long run, you'll save money with a "custom" mould.

https://brooksmoulds.com/index.html

I know half dozen guys using the 881 and they have all been dead on. Including mine. I'm sure a bad one happens, but the odds are pretty good. I think Saeco is the best of the "big"mold makers, and that design is a baseline that every 45-70 owner ought to have, imho.

Lead shrinks when cooling. You can measure the inside of the mould with the inside part of a caliper right on the part line, this should tell you how big the nose will be. If it measures over bore dia it will cast too big.

Luke wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 8:27 am I know half dozen guys using the 881 and they have all been dead on. Including mine. I'm sure a bad one happens, but the odds are pretty good. I think Saeco is the best of the "big"mold makers, and that design is a baseline that every 45-70 owner ought to have, imho.

Well, I guess we'll find out. The 881 should show up early next week, which is fine because I'm in Korea until Friday anyway. I'll shoot off the Lyman ammo that I made this coming weekend and see how it does - also to "make brass" since I'm still waiting for my Starline order - and I'll test the new mold as soon as it arrives.