1874 Military 50-70

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Jeff Michel
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by Jeff Michel » Fri Nov 26, 2021 4:33 pm

A friend of mine has a Farmingdale carbine in 50-70. Very accurate with a 450 Lee sized at .512. It has a very heavy trigger pull, that would be the only downside. I liked it well enough to order my own this past July.

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Cabinfever35
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Location: Cheyenne, Wyoming

Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by Cabinfever35 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:49 pm

Hi Jeff that’s good to know I haven’t seen much talk about the military 1874. I sure like the looks of them and I know that Kirk makes a fine rifle. I will be ordering mine first of the new year. I am not sure what bullet mold to get but will have time to research that avenue. And thanks to all you guys for posting your thoughts in my carbine endeavor. :D

Bart
Well Mr. Carpet Bagger ever been on a Missouri boat ride!!!
(Outlaw Jose Wells)

George Babits
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by George Babits » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:31 pm

I've had a couple of Shiloh military carbines in 45-70 and, while they are pretty handy, the recoil is significant with full loads. I now have a 50-70 original and it is not nearly as hard of a "kicker." I use the Lyman 515141 bullet and 67 grains of FFg. With that slow twist I have been thinking of trying the 350 grain Lyman 515139. I use that bullet in the Spencer and Maynard carbines and it has plenty of steam for anything. I think there also was a carbine loading in the 50-70 like there was with the 45-70 but not sure just what it was. And, if you want a "military" carbine, it needs to have the military butt plate, plain wood stock. and saddle ring to be "correct."

George

bohemianway
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by bohemianway » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:35 pm

As PM'd I have a Farmngdale civilian carbine (DST and no barrel band). Anyone's thoughts on DSTs here? Not traditional but makes it easier to shoot. With DSTs you don't have to set the trigger and it will function the same as a single.

Charles

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Luke
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Location: Central Missouri

Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by Luke » Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:22 pm

Most of the original Sharps 1874 Military Carbines were sold without the patch box. Many if not most did not have saddle rings either. THe 1874 carbines were never adopted by any military, going out as private sales. The 59/63 conversions were the ones with these features.

Don't see a DST being all that useful in a carbine meant for off hand shooting and hunting. Why pay extra for something you don't need.
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George Babits
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by George Babits » Sat Nov 27, 2021 8:17 am

I think original 1874 carbines, civilian (no barrel band or saddle ring) or military, are pretty darn sacrce. Most of the original carbines are 50-70 conversions of the 1863 New Model.

George

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Luke
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Location: Central Missouri

Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by Luke » Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:47 pm

Marcot shows 494 1874 military carbines shipped. .50-70 by far the most popular caliber. There were a surprising number of .50-2".

Marcot has no numbers for the civilian (no barrel band) carbines, calling it a "small, undisclosed number".
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VenisonRX
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Location: Mayflower, Arkansas

Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by VenisonRX » Sat Nov 27, 2021 8:53 pm

I’ve got an original 63 carbine converted to 50-70 (model 68) and it doesn’t have a patch box. Most of them didn’t unless it was converted over from a 59 carbine (model 67). I also have a shiloh carbine in 45-70. It’s a fantastic setup for a woods hunting gun. Good choice one no saddle ring. In the woods it is very loud. I took the ring off mine.

The 50-70 isn’t much on recoil with the military butt. It shoulders and carries nicely. The exception is shooting prone. If you don’t have the butt all the way up on your shoulder the top of the butt will let you know you screwed up. Same thing with the 45-70. The 45-70 is worse because I’m shooting a heavier 500 grain bullet. But again even with that it’s not really any worse than anything else you’re probably already shooting.

Seems to me most of the time when people talk about recoil with these black powder cartridges, they are the ones actively competing and they shoot a couple hundred rounds or so in a sitting. That would wear on your shoulder pretty quick. For us more casual shooters 20 rounds in a day on a weekend isn’t too bad at all. There’s always exceptions of course but that’s just what I’ve noticed.
—Tom

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VenisonRX
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by VenisonRX » Sat Nov 27, 2021 9:25 pm

The short and sweet of everything I said back there is, the carbine is an excellent little hunting gun, the 50-70 rules, and you’re going to love it even without a patch box or saddle ring if you choose not to get those. Definitely get what you want though. Looks matter. If it isn’t pretty to you it’ll just take up space in your safe. The 2 shilohs I have I bought used because the original owners didn’t get what they wanted in the first place.

Now for your enjoyment here’s a picture of my 50-70.
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—Tom

Tomklinger
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by Tomklinger » Sun Nov 28, 2021 4:59 am

Sharps also made the model 1869. It was pretty much like the ‘63 and’65 only it had the ‘74 style lock plate which didn’t have the primer device. This model was also built as a sporting rifle. They made 500 carbines.Not sure on how many sporting rifles. They were available 57/70, 44/77, and .60cal. fwiw….
Tom

George Babits
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by George Babits » Sun Nov 28, 2021 8:40 am

You don't have to take the saddle ring off to quiet it down. Just tie a short piece of leather into the loop like the old Red Ryder BB guns had. The ring is also handy if you don't have a saddle scabbard. A large loop of leather thong in the ring allows you to hang the carbine on your saddle horn.

George

bobw
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by bobw » Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:57 am

Tomklinger wrote:
Sun Nov 28, 2021 4:59 am
Sharps also made the model 1869. It was pretty much like the ‘63 and’65 only it had the ‘74 style lock plate which didn’t have the primer device. This model was also built as a sporting rifle. They made 500 carbines.Not sure on how many sporting rifles. They were available 57/70, 44/77, and .60cal. fwiw….
Tom
Friend of mine got one on trade he thought it was a conversion carbine. I used Sellers for the reference and showed him it was an original 69 6 grooved rifling as opposed to the 3 groove liner , right lock plate for the 69 and it had a 50-2" chamber not to many of those either. Was in real nice original condition. .bobw
bobw

George Babits
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by George Babits » Mon Nov 29, 2021 3:12 pm

Some of the conversions also have 6 groove rifeling as well, but will have the pellet primer feed on the lock plate. These were conversions where the boore and groove were a bit tighter than most of the percussion carbines. However, they seldom shoot well with standard 50-70 bullets. I've heard these called 52-70s and they shoot well with a proper bullet mould. I had one, and the bore was great, but it was missing the chamber sleeve that had been used in the conversion to 50-70.

George

bobw
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by bobw » Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:11 pm

The 50-70 conversion carbines that have 6 grooves and lands retained their original bore as the were slugged and found less than .5225" in dia. Those that exceeded .5225" were bore out and a 3 groove ( springfield style) liner installed. It's in Sellers page 175-179 explaining the whole percussion to cartridge conversion complete with numbers. Bobw
bobw

bobw
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Re: 1874 Military 50-70

Post by bobw » Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:38 am

bobw wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:11 pm
The 50-70 conversion carbines that have 6 grooves and lands retained their original bore as the were slugged and found less than .5225" in groove dia. Those that exceeded .5225" were bored out and a 3 groove ( springfield style) liner installed. It's in Sellers page 175-179 explaining the whole percussion to cartridge conversion complete with numbers. Bobw
Corrections past edit time bob
bobw

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