I recovered 24 bullets of which 2 had their newspaper wad stuck at the base. Some had still the lube in the grooves. ( I am not an expert eith the cam ...). Just a few were shorter by no more than 0.015 inch. Most were longer.
Thanks Etienne for sharing, I too have used the Paul Jones 45001, but no longer for long range shooting as is the SAECO 740. It is just fine to 600 yards.
Where I have wandered with the Dan Theodore Designed Money bullets and the very similar BACO Money bullets is why I went to 1-16 for long range in both .44 & .45 caliber rifles.
As you might imagine there is precious little snow in Arizona along the Mexican border so I have to be content with shot groups on targets 800 to 1,000 yards distant. What I find is 1-16 seems to give tighter core groups, little to no leading and the money design seems to shoot flatter and is not as affected by wind. Combined with a 1-16 twist I see enough advantage at 1,000 yards using the money bullet to stick with 1-16 alloy. Of course, other shooters at other ranges using other rifles may experience different results.
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
etienne,
old eyes cannot see too well.
do those fired bullets have rifling marks on what is described as the bore riding section, which is the section between the ogive and the bands?
if so the bullets are bumping into the rifling where they should be just bore riding.
this is a recipe for leading.
forst shot on a clean barrel is the greatest risk when blowtibing, as the bore is lubed for later shots.
if they are bumping into the rifling, do they do so without going a little sideways - how do you tell?
sideways puts the centre of gravity of the bullet in a different axis than the centre of mass.
the question you have to ask is "if they were smooth bullets, where would you patch them up to?"
keep safe,
bruce.
way and I mean WAY beyond the time I would spend doing that.
Great info though, and thanks for all the work.
I went from 1 16 to 1 20 for the lead for my 420 .392 PP mold for the 40 Sharps .400 bore. I patch and size in a .400 die after patching to smooth the patch. I shot a 1 1/4 inch 5 shot group today at 100 yards. OK... not all were like that, but that''s the one I'll brag about.
I mention it here because the 420 PP, .394 mold is long and thin, but shoots to aim which means no nose slump.
Etienne, that bullet looks just fine. If you are seating the bullet into the rifling while it is in a fireformed unsized case that is where I was getting my best groups with the Jones 45001 1-20 alloy at 200 & 300 yards in a 45-70 and 45-90. Groups so small you would have had to have been there and seen them to believe them. I don't think/recall recovering any bullets that nice, mostly because Arizona backstops are blessed with a lot of rock and rocks are hard on bullets.
The target will tell you the story. Listen carefully to what it says.
The only time I shoot at 100 yards is zeroing the sights, not for groups.
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
gunlaker wrote:It is interesting that most of your bullets came out longer than they were when they were cast.
Chris.
Hi Chris,
IMHO, the bullet has a diameter up to the groove diameter: so the lands have something to do with the superfluous lead ... so the bullet becomes longer ??
Still oping to see you at Ottawa next August for the annual Canadian BP long range Championships ... Dave Gullo and Frank Manikowski will be there !
By the way, I am still wanting to beat Dave at 1,000 yards … lol lol
desert deuce wrote:Etienne, that bullet looks just fine. ( …. ) I don't think/recall recovering any bullets that nice, mostly because Arizona backstops are blessed with a lot of rock and rocks are hard on bullets.
That is the pleasure to shoot in the snow ...
Here is what I get in the summer, in the sand: ... lol lol
I might make it to Ottawa one of these days. It's certainly something I've thought about doing.
These days I'm spending more time in the mountains than shooting my black powder rifles. I haven't put a round downrange since the middle June but that's going to change soon. I've got some experiments planned with some freshly cast 459540M3 bullets and the .45-2.4" Long Range Express.
I also noted the lack of finning on the base of the two bullets you could plainly see the base on.
Would it make sense that if the bullet was at groove diameter and it was squeezed at ignition rather than bumped up due to obturation that there would be rather significant finning ?
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
Zack what I find interesting is that most of the bullets came out longer, and the lengths really aren't very consistent.
It also reminds me that I've heard people claim significant increases in stability from a 0.050" reduction in bullet length.
I imagine that hundreds of thousands of 45001 PJ Creedmoor bullets have been shot out of Shiloh rifles over the years and they obviously shoot pretty well. Very few people catch bullets and examine them. I wonder how common this is?
