New Bullet

[ChrisF]

Thanks

[SchuetzenDave]

Chris a Sg of 1.4 or less means the bullet is not spinning fast enough and a Sg over 2.0 means the bullet is overspinning (but is not as critical as an under spun bullet).

Your rifle would prefer a longer and heavier bullet that would get it closer to an Sg of 2.0.

[Coltsmoke]

Chris you are traveling a road that I and others have done in the past. Just get a Lyman Postel bullet and be done. It takes up some powder room in the case, easy to load, will shoot better than all these short bullets you are wanting to try. I've tried at least 3 different short bullets, as high as 4 wads in the case, puff-lon to reduce the powder charge, and so on and so on. Save all the powder and lead and time and cleaning brass and primers and patches, you get the idea. Just buy a Lyman Postel and carry on. Shoot a money bullet or what ever you want at all the lay downs, maybe even the Postel.

[desert deuce]

Seriously? you can shoot the Lyman Postel down to 57.5 grains swiss 1.5 by volume with .100 compression in a 45-70
and if that is to much recoil get a 40-65

[gunlaker]

Seriously? you can shoot the Lyman Postel down to 57.5 grains swiss 1.5 by volume with .100 compression in a 45-70
and if that is to much recoil get a 40-65

Did that copy of the Postell bullet you got BACO to make end up working well? I have a highwall with a Ron Smith barrel that has a pretty tight bore. A little too tight for the nose diameter on any of the off the shelf Money bullets, but that Postell wouldn't have that problem.

Chris.

[mdeland]

Is there really a problem with over spinning a bullet if the alloy does not strip in the rifling?
I've heard that theory off and on for many years but have never heard definitively if it is true or not.

[martinibelgian]

IMO, absolutely not.... And it most certainly is way better than too slow a twist.

[bruce m]

what gert says.
such a bullet will handle windshear .
any twist we are likely to use in a rifle will come nowhere near overspinning a bullet such that it won't shoot.
guys use 300 gn bullets in 458 win mag at over 2000 fps with 14" twists successfully.
bruce.

[SchuetzenDave]

Effects of Over spinning a bullet:

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/201 ... a-problem/

[SchuetzenDave]

Correct: You can not over stabilize a bullet by overspinning.

However over spinning can affect accuracy.

[SchuetzenDave]

Correct: You can not over stabilize a bullet by overspinning.
Actually it reduces drag.

However over spinning can affect accuracy.

[desert deuce]

This is a subject that Dan Theodore and I hashed around and around and around numerous times. Did we come to any mathematically proven positions on the subject? Not that I recall. We did agree that if hard fouling in the barrel was not controlled nothing else mattered.

We did evolve into an idea that was loosely referred to by us as "The Balanced Load" and how to achieve it. The emphasis and basis of the idea was evolutionary and is rooted in the 21st Century of BPTR Long Range Shooting experiences we observed. The conclusion was that on any given day, on any given range in a match fired under the conditions existing for that shot the result at the target was most favorable to the shooters score. This became the desired result. In search of which bullets and chambers were designed, primers tested, barrel twists tested and bullet lube developed, hard fouling control techniques developed, etc, etc.

Honestly, Dan frequently lost me in explaining various theories and thinking. The concept that seemed to be a stumbling block for many ideas was what happens to the bullet and how it reacts in the bullet path between the time the bullet first crosses the line of sight until the second time the bullet crosses the line of sight before striking the target. It was/is a dizzying array of factors. Obviously the line of sight is perpendicular to the target and the bullet path is not. This is where it was discovered that there were no constants only variables.

Imagine then trying analytically to develop the ideal Balanced Load when dealing with unknown variables? In the end we finally agreed that the truly important factor was what worked best under variable match conditions. It was at this point that loading a particular rifle for an individual shooter became as much art form as science and class was held at long range matches and in long range practice.

The fly in the ointment grew largely when the shooter has 20 minutes to fire ten shots for record with sighters at 1,000 yards without a spotter.

As a result of actually shooting BPTR rifles at long range did we prove any theorems? Not really, BUT, I ask you, "how many successful long range shooters today use 45 caliber bullets of the money design in barrels with a 1-16 twist with 1-16 alloy or harder with pistol primers?"

[gunlaker]

There definitely seems to be a formula that works! I will be more or less sticking to that formula next weekend. Hopefully the wind gods will be kind .

With respect to the lighter bullet, it seems that BACO has a lot of "chicken bullet" designs for .45 cal. I expected more people to have shared their experiences with them. I've never tried them myself, as I shoot a .40-65 for silhouette, and with the .40-65 they are all chicken bullets

With respect to short bullets in fast twists I don't have much experience at all, but I can say that my 1:16 twist .45-2.4" paper patch rifle has shot minute of angle groups at 200m with a stubby 1.295" long Creedmoor bullet. I found that out when fire forming some brass when the rifle was new.

Chris.

[martinibelgian]

Chris, you should know that isn't possible, that bullet has some serious overspin in a 16 inch twist barrel . Accuracy should be sh*t...

[bruce m]

how much shorter is a 490 gn money bullet than a 500 gn incorrectly named creedmoor bullet?

bruce.