Barrel Help

[VenisonRX]

Got a 63-68 conversion carbine with a unique problem. Took it out to admire the other day and I felt the barrel shift. Pulled off the handguard and lever spring. Took a look at it and I was able to unscrew the barrel by hand.

Under close inspection I can’t find any problems with the barrel or the receiver as far as cracks or anything. The barrel appears to have just always been over timed for lack of a better term. Taking the barrel to hand tight the witness mark on the barrel is about 1/32in past the one on the receiver.

At hand tight the block will no longer close nor will the ejector fit into the slot cut into the barrel so I know everything “head-spaces”correctly when the witness marked are aligned.

Through my own research and advice from others it would seem that peening or rolling the barrel sleeve (not gonna do that), red loctite (not sure if that’s smart either), or shimming the barrel are the potential fixes. At face value I don’t see why making a round shim and fitting it between the barrel and receiver would hurt anything. Anyone here with more experience with sharps see anything like this before and might know better? Other than a chamber cast and basic disassembly/reassembly I’ve never done any real work on a single shot rifle before.

[VenisonRX]

Here’s a few pictures to show what I’m talking about

-Tom

[kenny s]

Ok, first don't panic. I have one too, and they are great guns to shoot.
because they have been converted by the Sharps factory after the CW, parts were buffed, markings buffed off and parts exchanged at will.
The barrel probably is not from the original percussion gun, and the witness mark may not be the same on two guns. OR NOT
You want the gun to work, so I would focus on that. First, I would try a shim made of thin spring steel, not brass. or even paper or plastic for a test.
you would then be able to see how it shoots. Don't forget, when you turn the barrel, you're turning the sights too, and a little goes a long way here.
If you find the place where you get good accuracy, and they are accurate, and the action works well,That is the spot. mark it with two abutting pieces of masking tape and a sharp pencil. Then, red locktite and you're done.
I had an 1860 Colt .44 army with a loose center cylinder pin. these cannot be removed because they are factory pinned. I cleaned with alcohol as best I could, put red locktite on it, and shot it for years. never a problem.
You are just experiencing normal 130 year old wear.....

let us know....Ken

[kenny s]

PS. DON'T PEEN ANYTHING.... just take that from me...Ken

[kenny s]

PSS. do the serial numbers match?

[VenisonRX]

Kenny,

Everything seems to line up well with the witness marks so my first attempt will be to shim it timed to that. Not sure it was ever shot since the barrel was relined (3 grove bore/slugs to about .515) so I would like to keep this one working and on the gun. I’ll have it rebarreled as a sporter like on page 28 of Roy Marcot’s book before I peen anything. Does Kirk rebarrel original actions?

If I did the math right and using the circumference and the distance past the witness marks I should need a shim at .002 thick. My plan is to order some from McMasters and cut them to fit. I’ll let everyone knows how it works out in case anyone else runs into this issue.

Interesting you mention the serial number. The tang doesn’t have one and the underside of the barrel has two. One of them is X’ed out. My guess is the second number matched what used to be on the tang and the tang one was likely buffed off with the rest of the metal finish on this thing. I don’t think it was a broken tang that was repaired since all the machining marks match on the underside.

Here’s a few more photos for your enjoyment

-Tom

[desert deuce]

This may be a question for Aero.

[kenny s]

ok. yup that's it. the sn of the original bbl was x'ed out and the replacement bbl. was used. so the marks not matching are a good GUESS that is what happened. Dixie Gun works used to sell NEW barrels....$50 those good ol' days. had one once and never used it. may be able to fine an original replacement bbl. I did that on a trapdoor once, worked great.
A new bbl is ok, and will work but you should be able to use this bbl.
how about wrapping the threads with something to tighten it?
you should not be able to turn the bbl by hand. it should fit tighter than that. look at the muzzle and see if there is a ring where the
liner will show. Mine has that. they took worn .52 cal and lined them to 50. but not all....yours could be either and be original.

the lined bbl.s are very accurate...

try to wrap the threads, and then wrap and locktite and you should be fine.
You want a tight fit between bbl and action for safety....no space....
the charge for these things is not 70 but 66 grains . don't overload...
Ken

[VenisonRX]

Gonna do my best to stick to the original bbl. Its definitely a Springfield armory relined barrel which is what tempted me to buy it in the first place. Three groves is what gave it away. zero pitting/leading/dust. Don’t think it was ever shot before coming to me. My guess is it was rebuilt at the factory as the stock shows a lot of wear where it would have been handled and every bit of finish is buffed off the metal even underneath the handguard. After being rebuilt and relined it appears to have been packed in grease and placed in storage which seems to go along with any history I’ve read on the things. According to Roy Marcot a lot of them were in pretty rough shape showing up to the factory.

Tom

[Woody]

Yes, they were cleaned and "buffed", but they were re-cased and re-blued also. If unfired, it should look "new" with "faded" markings. Have owned three and still own one. Shoots great.

Woody

[Woody]

Yes, they were cleaned and "buffed", but they were re-cased and re-blued also. If unfired, it should look "new" with "faded" markings. Have owned three and still own one. Shoots great.

Woody

[VenisonRX]

The finish on this one has been removed for sure. At some point someone took the metal down to “the white”. It was awhile ago because that old lacquer like dried grease/oil coating on antique guns was all over the outside. No case coloring left and the only bluing left is in the hardest to reach parts around the lever spring area. Mechanically it’s perfect and the bore looks brand new which is what lead me to believe it hadn't been shot since being converted. Any common practices back in the day that caused people to remove the finish on firearms and make them “in the white”?

[kenny s]

yup. started when True Value started selling sand paper! Oh Well....

(I may have been guilty of it once too)
Then did 25 years of Antique gun repair and restoration. the nicest thing a client could say when I delivered the gun was.
..'looks like you didn't touch it" Ken

[Woody]

At the time of the Civil War "Arsenal Bright" was a term used for the issued rifled muskets. These were issued in the white, with only a few small parts blued or color cased. Most other weapons of the period, whether military or civilian were "finished", utilizing color case hardening, and blueing. Although solders were encouraged to "scower" any rust, etc. from there weapons, this did not result in the complete removal of original finish.


Concerning your loose barrel, I once tightened a barrel, on a 44/40 lever gun, by wrapping a couple of strands of copper wire into the threads and then reinstalling. It remained tight for the several thousand additional rounds that I put through it while I still owned it. One of those I wish I had back.

Woody

[Woody]

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Here's mine. Paid $375.00 back in the late 70's for it.

Woody