new rifle

[martinibelgian]

45° transition or not - I've been shooting military rifle for some time, and those rifles do have a pretty generous and shallow taper at the end of the chamber, there is no 'case stop' or 45° degree transition. It does have its advantages: Case length is much less critical, and a bullet bumping up (and yes, it will) will be gently resized to the final diameter. A bullet bumping up between case mouth and 45° case stop, however, will be subjected to a much more abrupt transition,and case length (as in too long or too short) can be a major accuracy issue.

Which one shoots better? All my match rifles have the 45°, the (original) military rifles the gentle taper - but it is retty hard to compare accuracy of course...

[PhilRich]

I have a rifle on order in 45-70 and have been reading this thread with interest, especially concerning which chamber design to choose.

Would someone please define the specs for the Shiloh standard chamber?

[Don McDowell]

I posted something here way back on page 4. Ever since I’ve been following the continuing comments. I do not know what my CSA 40-70 chamber is but assume a “standard” but it doesn’t matter since it is what I have and I’m not going to change it.

A friend gave me a bunch of paper samples. The (11) samples range in thickness between 0.0045” down to 0.0015”. I have a .40 cal. BACO patch template. The first paper I tried, 0.003” thick, resulted in a wrapped bullet that was too large to enter an unsized, as-fired, case. The next paper is 0.0024” thick and will enter the case and mic’s 0.408”, too large to be considered a “bore” diameter wrapped bullet? My Paul Jones greasers are 0.410” outside diameter. Then I tried the thinnest paper sample, dress pattern paper at 0.0015” thick. That wrapped bullet easily enters the case and mic’s 0.398”.

The slugs are BACO 0.395” dia. examples. So….look for a different thickness paper, lengthen or shorten the patch or specify a different slug diameter when I eventually order a mold?

More to learn and enjoying it all!

Tom

My wife’s 4065 CSA highball really shoots well wit the BACO .396 415M cast 16-1 and wrapped with Seth cole 55w
Stuffed into starline brass on top of 64 grains OE 2f

[ian45662]

Kurt those don’t look much different than mine. The last bullet you posted looks like it may have some kind of wrinkle near the bottom but maybe that’s some trick with the lighting?

No they are very similar. The wrinkle is from the patch getting pulled down a little I think. I see this quite often if I didn't get the case mouth chamfered.
I'm really surprised that your water bullets don't get nose damage hitting the water. I did this once and it flattened the nose slightly. Maybe the allow was softer, it's been a while I used water.

I was surprised to but they look great. Not any distortion that we could tell from.

[ian45662]

I have a rifle on order in 45-70 and have been reading this thread with interest, especially concerning which chamber design to choose.

Would someone please define the specs for the Shiloh standard chamber?

.
Basically the Shiloh chamber has the 45 degree transition into a freebore that .460 in diameter and .050 long. The mouth of the case has a diameter of .481. From there it has a lead of 2.5 degrees

[TAA]

Don,

Any idea how thick that Seth Cole 55W is?

I’ve seen that brand/type mentioned on this forum before.

Thanks!

Tom

[Don McDowell]

Would have to try and measure it but there are several here that use it. I also use quite a bit of the Seth cole 55y which is a 7 lb paper

[ian45662]

2 wraps of the 55w adds about .005

[Distant Thunder]

Tom,

If your bullets are straight sided and .395" diameter I would think you want paper that will add .005" making them .400+/-, but I don't know the bore diameter of your rifle. In the end you want the bullets to be patched so you can push them through your barrel with a cleaning rod and feel some slight resistance.

I've use a little of the 55W and I think that should add about .005". The main thing is you want your pathed bullet to fit so they require somewhat of a push into the bore. Too loose isn't the best for target loads, but is supposed to be good for hunting loads, and too tight and you'll have trouble chambering rounds without damaging the paper. You want them to fit just right!

Some will say you don't want your 2 wraps of paper to be thicker than your rifling is deep, but I've also been told that if the paper is too thin you can get leading. I use paper 9# paper which adds about .007" and that seems to work pretty well. Good accuracy and no leading.

[semtav]

I will have a 40-82 silhouette, arriving sometime around xmas, It will be a #1 roller, sport a 34in barrel (from Green Mtn), orig wood, not sure on sights, was told .400/.408 for the barrel. anyone have any luck PP'ing for this round?? I believe its a 1-14 twist.

Yes but I patch to groove so wouldn't be much help to you. Be better if you started a new thread instead of getting lost in this one.

[Distant Thunder]

Kurt,

The first two bullets good, but there are a couple of things that don't look right on the base of that 3rd bullet. That line where the paper got a wrinkle in it and the base at the very bottom looks somewhat rebated, undersize compared to the shank. It just doesn't look good at the base not sure what caused those two things.

There are so many things that can happen to a lead bullet when it gets that hard kick in the butt that it's hard to believe any of them fly true and straight to 1000 yards!

Thanks for the pictures, that a start.

[semtav]

Brian you really need to get to a paper match and see the difference.
Different worlds, and the benefit of shooting target you see where each shot hits, as it's marked with a spotting disc.

Don
If you remember, I did make myself a mock BPTR range. Complete with a regulation size Target.
Was hoping to use the Bullseye system for scoring but just never could get it to work at 1000 yards. So I have to make a scoring bunker and clear a little sagebrush so I can shoot prone to finish it.

[SSShooter]

No newspaper wad needed with paper-patch. Correct?

[ian45662]

Glenn no. The only wad I am using is a polly wad. If you use a grease cookie you might want to but I have never used one of those either

[Distant Thunder]

Glen,

The folded over paper at the base serves the same purpose as the newspaper wad would. When the patch comes off at the muzzle the wad can't suck to the base. Also with no lube on the base to help the wad to stick you're good.

Lube wads just become one more variable and I've only used them with pp when I've had to.