BPCR Attendance Decline.....

[Jim Kidwell]

I know it is much easier to shoot smokeless, but don't forget the nostalgia of the "old dead guys" and how they developed the ultimate in rifles and the ammunition they used. There is no better satisfaction in trying to duplicate their success. There are many disciplines out there that use less than MOA accuracies using "Race Guns", but what is the challenge? In our sport, we are neophytes and try to match our skills to past Masters.

Somehow we need to stop the decline of our matches. It will take the unsung shooters out there that could keep them going.
We have many out there that want to compete, but are unwilling to step up or have no idea how they can help.
You just need to ask. There are many on this forum that are willing to answer any questions you may have. Just ask, don't let it prevent our decline in participation......FWIW................

[Kurt]

Jim.
I think it's not only the smokeless race gun causing the decline. I think the interest is there, I see it anyway. Lets face it the percentage of us shooting the black powder rifle matches are close to retirement or way past. Some of the matches are declining but I see increases in the Gong shoots. The local Silhouette matches I shoot at they are holding pretty steady. One would have to ask why the decline in some matches.

[ChrisF]

I think cost is one reason

[bruce m]

having to think is a problem.
removing challenge is the modern mantra.
bruce.

[40-65rl]

Out here, the West, the problem is too many matches and not enough time for all of them. I have mid range matches and get 20 shooters one month and 6 the next because of other matches in the area. But “the area” is part of the attendance issue. Shooters from Wyoming drive 6-8!hours to shoot, thanks Kenny, and even the folks in Colorado drive though that crap traffic in Denver at 00 thirty dark to shoot. Just getting to a match can be an issue itself. Think some black shooters are very picky about where and when they travel, thus the reduced or uncertain numbers for any given match. With that said, matches with a very good reputation will have good turnouts, Smithmoor .22 Bpcra Rocky Mountain regionals and the wyoming state bpcr silhouette championships sellout every time. Byers and Cheyenne have two of the premier target ranges west of the Mississippi but the national mid range at Byers mustered only 8 shooters, however, the creedmoor nationals next week is sold out. Go figure!

[40-65rl]

Out here, the West, the problem is too many matches and not enough time for all of them. I have mid range matches and get 20 shooters one month and 6 the next because of other matches in the area. But “the area” is part of the attendance issue. Shooters from Wyoming drive 6-8!hours to shoot, thanks Kenny, and even the folks in Colorado drive though that crap traffic in Denver at 00 thirty dark to shoot. Just getting to a match can be an issue itself. Think some black shooters are very picky about where and when they travel, thus the reduced or uncertain numbers for any given match. With that said, matches with a very good reputation will have good turnouts, Smithmoor .22 Bpcra Rocky Mountain regionals and the wyoming state bpcr silhouette championships sellout every time. Byers and Cheyenne have two of the premier target ranges west of the Mississippi but the national mid range at Byers mustered only 8 shooters, however, the creedmoor nationals next week is sold out. Go figure!

[Michael Johnson]

I think that ChrisF is correct about the cost issue. The rifles, the particulars of hand loaded ammo etc. I think that the time involved to do all of this and to travel to different venues is another issue. I did this up until about six years ago and then just could not devote the time to be competitive. I am 63 and work 55-60 hours per week at a full time job. I hope to do a lot more in 18 months when I retire. It would be nice if it was more affordable for young people. A lot of clubs do have 200 yard matches for BPCR. That is definitely a good starting point. We need to encourage our kids as well as younger competitors as well. Just my thoughts. - Mike

[Lumpy Grits]

Many shooting sports are seeing a sharp decline in participation for one reason or another.
Lots of folks have lost jobs over the C-19 issue.
I also wonder how many ranges have been destroyed in these fires.q
Gary

[jackrabbit]

You guys drive me nuts yacking about the cost being the biggest detriment to our sport. I challenge you to name a cheaper sport. Maybe jogging?? Like that's even a sport. By the way, if you see me jogging, load your gun because someone is clearly chasing me and trying to kill me. I know for a fact from first hand experience it is not team roping, rodeo, race cars, snowmobiles, snow skiing, fishing, airplanes, water skiing, rc airplanes, motorcyles, etc, etc, etc. Heck, even the guys I know that bowl have lots of money into fancy bowling balls and all the other junk they think they need. Part of the reason I am involved is because I am now married with 3 little kids and can no longer afford these other sports.

One can get into our sport and win for less than $3,000. I only own 3 BPCR rifles, none of which are fancy. The one I win silhouette with is a plain jane C.Sharps I bought used and could be duplicated today for less than 2 grand. In this day and age, that is not that much money. If one cannot afford that, they probably shouldn't be playing any games and be finding a better job. Take a walk over to a trap range or better yet, a PRS match. Holy cow do those guys spend the money! I have had fun in BPCR figuring out how to do it without spending the big bucks.

The fact is, if BPCR is something you want to do, you will find a way. If your heart is not truly in it, you will make some lame excuse like "it's too expensive."

After being in a hundred discussions and trying to analyze why there has been decreasing in numbers, I still believe it is because of a lack of great match directors. I hate to sound like I am patting myself on the back, but we have built a good following of shooters here at Smithmoor from an area that has very few people. Probably 25% of them are guys that just started shooting BPCR in the last couple of years. We haven't done anything special, we just have fun, spread the word, be encouraging and helpful to new guys that are interested, and try to run a good match. That's it. I truly hope that folks can see what we are doing and think they can do that themselves, because they can!

Think about being a match director. Put your own spin on it, try out something new. If you build it, they will come!
Cody

[Don McDowell]

I have a Winchester 101 pigeon grade shotgun that cost me more than a new shiloh.. Cost I don't think is much of a factor, especially when you look at a good trap gun or a 1911 for competition. BPCR ammunition is the cost factor, where I can get 250 trap/sporting clays rounds for under 100$ and not have to spend hours casting and reloading. Even this new PRC stuff the gun cost is horrible, and with the scope would cost 2 new shilohs. Those trap/sporting clays and PRC matches are generally sold out before a person really has time to figure out if they want to go or not. Ever talk to a high power shooter and hear the horror story of 350 slot match being sold out in under 20 minutes?
It's more about want to, if a match is held and people enjoy it they will go back.
Time is a factor, I opted out of 2 matches this summer because I wanted to go fishing with family and friends, and I'll miss Dick's 22 match this week because it's my hope's that by the time they start shooting I'll either be getting the adrenaline rush of a bull elk coming in close enough to stick him with an arrow, or helping one of the crew I'm going with pack one out. I'll be home in time to kiss the wife pet the dogs, pack the ammo,guns and head to Byers, but that will likely be the last match for me until it's time to go to Phoenix.
Timing is a big factor, and if the "want to" is there. Lots of us are getting older and time spent doing things with kids/ grandkids we don't get to see very often, or enjoying a hunting trip with friends from several miles away, weigh into the attendance factor.

[ScrapMetal]

Personally, I think it is due to lack of exposure. I read a number of gun magazines every month and the only article I can remember was last year by Mike Venturino titled, "Is the Steel Chicken Dead?" talking about the decline and whether or not the sport of BPCR has one foot in the grave.

If people aren't even hearing about the sport or even know it exists they certainly won't be getting involved.

The only black powder you see in magazines is whatever the new whiz-bang modern muzzle loader which are just a hair's breath away from not being front stuffers any more. No articles on reloading with BP, let alone shooting.

I had been planning on writing some letters to the magazines encouraging them to cover more of the BPCR world and I would recommend everyone start doing that if you want to see more people getting involved. Maybe if GUNS had enough write-ins and saw that there was enough interest they would have Mike write regular articles concerning BPCR.

I think there would be a lot more interest if only more people knew about it.

JMHO

-Ron

[Don McDowell]

That might be part of it.
Over labor day we were at the Whittington. Part of the adventure we do when there is go thump the white buffalo. While I was getting the scope settings to get the son-in-law on to it, a pickup load of folks showed up and went to work with some strange looking camo stocked bolt guns. The gun guru of that bunch was telling everybody within ear shot how much knowledge he had, when one of his followers said look that guys shooting black powder. Mr Guru promptly pronounced if that's all you can do for a gun you ain't got much gun, See there he's not even getting close to those silhouette animals. "but Guru it looks like he's shooting at that Buffalo" Harumph I can do that with that 06 of yours. Guru picks up the 06 and proceeds to let forth a volley of fire at the buffalo. "Mr. Guru, you're not even getting any rounds into the dirt around it and that guy over there has hit it twice already" Apparently that was the end of the session because Mr. Guru all of a sudden pronounced ok it's time to go up to small bore range, the followers dutifully loaded up and they left in Mr. Guru's high boy fat tired truck in a cloud of dust.

[Michael Johnson]

I also think that we kill our young. How many times have we seen on this website (one of the premiere BPCR web sights in existence) where folks are literally cut to shreds by the all knowing cognoscenti. This is not a very friendly group. Folks say things with a keyboard that they would not dare say if they were sitting across a table from an armed individual. You guys know who you are! This is the great problem with social media. It inflates folks egos beyond that which is warranted.

[Steve Sudbeck]

I agree with MJ; this is a very rough crowd, some cavemen for sure, some really tough hombres. I mostly lurk on this forum for the knowledge, read only, very seldom login. The pompous egos I see on here are laughable; I simply do not want to be around bullies/ cowards like that. There is just no reason to be that aggressive, just angry people with angry lives that think they are John Wayne - too many movies. I will keep reading - I thank those that contribute, great reading. The ranting bullies need some reflection and maybe some counseling.

[jackrabbit]

BPCR is the elite rifle sport. You have to have a mastery of reloading, bullet casting, wind reading, understanding trajectory, load development, and most importantly marksmanship in order to post an average score. There is no way to buy your way into any of this, you have to learn it yourself. This is the main difference between BPCR and other firearms sports. It is only for the most dedicated and interested shooters. We will always be a smaller crowd, and that's ok. Everything ebbs and flows. I still think that when the most dedicated and intelligent of these new shooters get bored with ar-15's and boughten ammo, they will come looking for something more and we may see a resurgence in a few years. Good advice that was given to me years ago is "Do what you can." Write letters, take interested people to the range, tell folks about BPCR. Just do what you can close to home to help.

As for those whining about not wanting to get involved because they think they have been bullied online,grow a set of balls you friggin sissy! If you want some powder puff sport where we all hold hands and skip through the meadows together, look someplace else. You will not find a more interesting, intelligent, fun, loyal, and honest bunch of folks than those in BPCR, but they do not suffer fools, do not sugar coat things, and do not deceive you. Part of the bluntless is the open sharing of information. Everyone has their opinions on what to use and how to do things and are willing to share it. If you want to hear thoughts and ideas from other shooters, be prepared to hear things you don't agree with!
take care, Cody