Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

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desert deuce
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by desert deuce »

Forgot to mention, the year I won the Long Range International at Phoenix I was using ammunition some of which was over five years old. All 1-16 alloy in 45-90.
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

That's good feed back DD.
When Raymond Hansen used to live here in AK and we shot together quite a bit ,he used to tell both Bob Engelbach and me to loose the alloy with antimony in it for match work and our barrel leading issues would disappear. I took his advise on a trial and made up some 30-1 and gave it a try in grease bullets and sure enough the leading stopped pronto but as I was scoring high in midrange and could see no point increase I went back to the antimony alloy as I had nearly a ton of it on hand.
I have had quite a bit of fun trying to get two .303s I have to shoot PP bullets. Both of them shoot jacket bullets an the MKlll has done well with GGs to the 100 yards tested but I've had no luck at all with my home cut PP bullets. I'll keep trying till I figure out what they like.
I'm thinking the 5 groove barrel may like something a bit unconventional with PP bullets but time and experimentation will tell.
mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

DD is there any chance I could get you to test some of those old bullets for hardness if you still have some left ? Be neat to see what it is compared to when cast.
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desert deuce
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by desert deuce »

No, unfortunately, I buried them all in a back stop on their way to long range heaven.
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
Kenny Wasserburger
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by Kenny Wasserburger »

I maybe wrong, but I believe Ian Egbert was using 14-1 this weekend at the Joe Hepsworth memorial match. 1000 and 1200 yard matches. He won BTW. And he won with PP :shock: :shock:


Kenny W.

I am currently running approximately 15-1 using 95-5 Soldier to lower my 20-1 alloy to that ratio. Just barely over 1/4 pound of the solder. Approximately. 1.4 % of .280 pounds of solder is antimony so about .00392 pounds in a 25# Waage pot. Basically a very small amount. :roll:

This is the current alloy I used to win the 1000 yard segment of my Creedmoor match and tie for first at 800 yards. This is of course with my dual Diameter PP bullet.

KW
We'll raise up our Glasses against Evil Forces, Singing, Whiskey for my men, Beer for my horses.

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ian45662
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by ian45662 »

Yes I was shooting 14:1. I was playing with antimony in my alloy for some of this past season. Sometimes they would shoot really good and other times it was pretty bad…. I mean 3 pigs bad at one shoot :cry: I was adding antimony via wheel weights and that may have been where I went wrong. I mixed up a batch that was 16 Pounds soft lead 1 pound tin and 5 pounds WW. I made 7 or 800 projectiles with that alloy and shot them at various matches. I may revisit this test one day and use a certified antimony to add but I think I am going to take a break from testing stuff for a while and use what I know has been a consistent performer for me which is the lead and tin. That antimony alloy I mixed up did harden slightly over a 3 month period but seemed to level out after that.
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desert deuce
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by desert deuce »

Congrats Ian, good shooting.
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

What is the hardness on the 14-1 and did it get softer over time or stay stable ?
ian45662
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by ian45662 »

The 14:1 measured about the same as 16 did when tested that sort of stuff. It stayed at a stabile hardness. I went with 14 because when I was first getting into the wonderful world of paper patch I tried 16 and 14:1 and in a one time test the 14 seemed to shoot a little better. After that I made up a couple hundred pounds of alloy and shot that. I have never went back to revisit the 16 although I am sure it would shoot just fine but after the roller coaster ride I went on during the first half of the 2021 match season I have decided to just leave things the way they are and not experiment with alloys in 2022. Next month I will make a couple hundred pounds of alloy and start getting ready match season to fire back up. I will be working up loads for a couple of 38-50s though. Things might be a little hairy next year but we will have fun doing it.
mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

Thanks for your input and well done with your match win !
mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

Day three late evening BHN 8-9. I tested multiple times with each cycle. Looks like it's still getting harder but I doubt it will go up much more.
I think I may heat up this melt tomorrow without adding any more to it and water drop about ten of them and see what happens hardness wise.
beltfed
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by beltfed »

Here again is a reference from the NRA Handbook of Cast Bullets to Age hardening of PbSbSn alloys
PbSbSnAlloyAgeHardeningNRACBH.JPG
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mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

Thanks for that input Arnie. I have that reference and will pull it up to take another look at it. I don't remember it having this particular alloy mix data so I needed to run my own hardness test to get an idea of the character , BHN #'s and stability.
mdeland
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by mdeland »

I just finished casting and water dropping ten bullets of the same alloy and they were a point harder than was the non water dropped bullets at 7 BHN.
I'll track their hardness progression as well.
opencountry
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Re: Alloy hardness after cool down, 3 days and 7days

Post by opencountry »

This is the current alloy I used to win the 1000 yard segment of my Creedmoor match and tie for first at 800 yards. This is of course with my dual Diameter PP bullet.

KW
[/quote]

Nice work, Kenny.

Robert
Beware of the man that owns one rifle.
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