40-70 SS

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Glen Ring
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40-70 SS

Post by Glen Ring » Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:01 am

I'm considering a new rifle in 40-70 SS. Those of you that have experience forming brass for a 40-70 SS...what is the best route to make the cases?
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John Bly
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by John Bly » Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:08 am

Buy the stretched 30/40 Krag cases from BACO. Make sure of the rim counterbore depth when you buy them. They have them with the original 30/40 Krag rim or ones with the rim swaged forward for the Shiloh and original chambers.
"Perfection consists not so much in doing extraordinary things as in doing ordinary things extraordinarily well"

TAA
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by TAA » Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:32 am

Might not want overlook Hornady 405 Win. Cases. They are a tad too long but have the advantage of being able to be trimmed to the exact length that you need. Nor sure on the concern for rim thickness but if you tell the rifle make what brass you are going to use, they will make sure to take the rim thickness in consideration as the chamber is cut.

I do not shoot the quantity of matches that most posting here do, but my original (150) Hornady cases have been going great since 2010 when I bought the cases and the rifle. So far (3,893) rounds fired with these cases, or approx. (125) firings. I anneal after each firing.

Tom

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powderburner
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by powderburner » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:04 pm

Just call up Buffalo arms and order some. Thats easiest.
Dean Becker
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J.B.
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by J.B. » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:02 pm

I've primarily been using the stretched, BACo 30/40 Remington brass and its been working fine for some years now. On recommendation I purchased 100 x Hornady 405 cases and after some 'fine tuning' have found them to be very good but the case dimensions are different and on sizing you ' may' find the necks a bit thick for gg bullets. The current brass listings with BACo suggest their custom 40/70 cases are actually drawn from 30/40 Hornady brass currently. A call to Shiloh will likely clear up if they would chamber your 40/70 straight for the .405 Hornady brass and I believe a few may have gone this route in the past. Just be sure to lay in enough brass once the decision is made. The one suggestion I would put forward is that you have the barrel cut with a 1/14" twist, especially if you plan on long range. Just allows you a lot more scope with bullet weight and length. . That's about the only regret I have with my rifle. Its a beauty and shoots well. A chat with Shiloh and as Dean mentioned, an order to BACo and you should be good to go. My BACo brass has lasted well and imagine any made from Hornady brass will last as long if not longer. hth

J.B.
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John Bly
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by John Bly » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:32 pm

I recently got some 40/70 brass from BACO. They are not currently using the Hornady brass but Remington. The Remington has a little more case capacity. They have used Hornady is the past.
The 405 brass needs a lot of work to fit my Shiloh chamber. It must be cut to length, full length sized, neck turned and the base reduced in diameter to work in my chamber. It seems to shoot well once this is done but the capacity is a lot less than the stretched Remington Krag brass.
Another thing to consider, it is uncertain whether the Hornady 405 brass will be available in the future.
"Perfection consists not so much in doing extraordinary things as in doing ordinary things extraordinarily well"

Glen Ring
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by Glen Ring » Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:04 pm

Thanks Guys.
If you need to ask " What just happened?' you have probably lost.

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kenny s
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by kenny s » Tue Dec 03, 2019 9:40 am

BA 40 70 SS brass is available. my advice. order at least 100 while you can. they use 30 40 and it fits my Shiloh just fine.
You WILL have to use a full length die to sewage the lower part of the case. lots of lube and pull hard, but once done..it's over .
Then primer pocket and flash hole uniform. (while you're watching Quigley on TV) anneal them.
I will trim after firing to 2.498. I took a cerro safe cast of my chamber and it measures 2.53. You want a little space for expansion and
recoil.
I have used them for a long time and they are fine.
JBA was nice, but gone now.

67 grains of Swiss 1 1/2, slight compression
one 060 veggie wad,
a custom 360 PP mold two diameter.
base patches to .408, top to .400
wipe BT shots.

fun and ORIGINAL GO TO CALIBER IN 1880.
Ken

BFD
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by BFD » Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:28 am

I'm still wondering why you wouldn't just have a .405 chamber cut, use .405 Hornady brass, and call it a .40-70. They seem mighty close to being one in the same.

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powderburner
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by powderburner » Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:55 am

Hornady brass in 405 is non existant as is the 9x74 brass to convert into it.
I am really hoping hornady steps up and makes a run. My 405 win is becoming a safe queen
Dean Becker
only one gun and they are 74 s
3rd asst. flunky,high desert chapter F.E.S.
MYWEIGH scale merchant
reclining member of O-G-A-N-T

TAA
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by TAA » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:05 pm

Agree with BFD. I told the gun maker ahead of time about my intent to use 405 Win. cases. Did not have to FL size, turn necks or modify rims (bases). Just needed to trim to optimize the length for my specific chamber/rifle.

When I bought the cases, the distributor told me that Hornady makes those cases once a year, doing a specific run for the 405’s. Maybe that’s what they are doing still? I have (3) unopened boxes of 50 each, waiting in reserve until the day the original (150) that I bought 9-years ago eventually give up......but no sign of that yet!

Tom

Clarence
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by Clarence » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:44 pm

Brent,

That's what I did with mine, a custom Roller. Trimmed to 2.500", the Hornady brass fits perfectly, my RCBS dies from the early '90's do minimal sizing, and I have a lifetime supply of Hornady brass.

Clarence

BFD
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by BFD » Tue Dec 03, 2019 7:08 pm

I heard recently that .405 was being made or was going to be made again soon.

I bought a bunch of it years ago to use in my .38-72. It seems to be very good quality brass.

bruce m
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by bruce m » Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:58 pm

the 405 win case is dimensionally the same as the 40/72 win, other than the 405 has slight variations in the rim.
this is so that higher pressure 405 cannot be chambered in an old black powder weak rifle.
when loaded with black, the two are exactly the same.
with pp bullets seated 1/10" to 1/8" in the case, swiss 1.0 or 1.5 will fit about 85 gns in the case and give a 440 gn bullet about 1350 fps.
such a bullet with an elliptical nose goes head to head in the wind with a 45/2.4 using a 540 gn money bullet at about the same speed.
only thing is you need a 13" twist to stabilize the 440 gn bullet 1.5" long.
I use the same wind chart for both.
bruce.
ventum est amicus meus

Perentie
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Re: 40-70 SS

Post by Perentie » Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:18 am

BFD wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:28 am
I'm still wondering why you wouldn't just have a .405 chamber cut, use .405 Hornady brass, and call it a .40-70. They seem mighty close to being one in the same.
Thats what I did for the roller I built up on Cast Boolits.
I had the reamer drawn up and made by Pacific Tool to take the 405 Hornady brass untouched and thats what it does. That reamer is for PP only though.
Slowly getting it going . Might put in a 200 yd postal target :wink:
I called it a 40-72 H

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