Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Discussions of powders, bullets and loading information.

Moderators: Kirk, Lucinda

User avatar
J.B.
Posts: 644
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 10:31 pm
Location: Australia

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by J.B. »

Now now Brian....I think you should re-invent the wheel. I try it every year...and my best result was still with Kurts ammo :shock: Doesn't get much more 'borrowed' than that :oops: You'll just need to adjust the 'menuts' to suit. :wink: :lol:

rgds. Gavin.
"an experimental weapon..with experimental ammunition ? ...Lets experiment "
User avatar
Shadow 4
Posts: 456
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:41 pm
Location: BIG SKY COUNTRY

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Shadow 4 »

J.B. wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:51 pm Now now Brian....I think you should re-invent the wheel. I try it every year...and my best result was still with Kurts ammo :shock: Doesn't get much more 'borrowed' than that :oops: You'll just need to adjust the 'menuts' to suit. :wink: :lol:

rgds. Gavin.
'menuts'
:lol: :lol: :lol:
I can tell already, we are not going to be able to shoot together, they're going to have to split us up, we'll never make it, "borrowed" loads or not
Good grief :roll:
Cowards rule the world these days.
Coward rules & coward customs
To succeed today, all you've got to know is how to blame & how to complain
bruce m
Posts: 3350
Joined: Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:25 am
Location: australia

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by bruce m »

gert is on the money here.
both for smokeless and black.
sometimes you see sine wave activity on the group of targets, as loads increase.
when this happens the group at the top or bottom of the wave will give better vert at long range, as long as it groups.
bruce.
ventum est amicus meus
TexasMac
Posts: 2364
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:29 pm
Location: Central Texas
Contact:

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by TexasMac »

hepburnman wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 8:06 am In doing ladder testing, and increasing powder charges (and compression), don't stop at the first accurate load but continue with more powder (more compression) almost all the way up until the case starts to bulge and wont chamber fully. I have found (for my three rifles) that there are two "sweet spots" for good accuracy. In my case (1) 45-70 and (2) 40-65 rifles, that I had best accuracy at 63 gr and 70 gr (I could go all the way about 76 gr before chambering issues).
I therefore use the 63 gr load, with a 410 gr bullet (or 500 gr) for chickens, and the 70 gr. load, with a 430 gr (or 560 gr) bullet for everything else.
I use the same primers (Fed 215M) and Swiss 1.5Fg for all my loads.
I strongly agree with the above comments. Having used the ladder technique several times using different bullets with my Browning .40-65, two "sweet spots" were the norm. For example using Swiss 1.5F with the BACO 409400M5 the spots were 61gr & 69gr; with the BACO 410410M3 the spots were 60gr & 68gr. The tests were run at 200yds which, by the way, does not necessarily translate to the good accuracy at 500yds or meters. Unfortunately A load that prints a beautiful pattern at 200m may fall apart at longer distances for whatever reasons. I've experienced this on more than one occasion.

Wayne
NRA Life (Benefactor & President's Council) Member, TSRA Life Member, NSSF Member, Author & Publisher of the Browning BPCR book
http://www.texas-mac.com
User avatar
desert deuce
Posts: 3845
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 10:51 pm
Location: Rio Rico, Arizona

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by desert deuce »

And, a prospective long range load that shoots well at 200-500 Meters does not necessarily shoot well at long range, 800-900 & 1,000 yards. :wink:

For mid range, the M-65 500 yard target is usually a determiner of a good load/rifle/shooter combination as in a balanced load. :shock:

Actually the target has the last say in the matter at whatever proposed distance. A fact that if overlooked may imperil score. :D

Wondering if: as the powder charge is increased the spread of group increases if it is the sine wave doing the vertical distribution? AND, perhaps increases the distribution as the barrel warms? Especially in frostbite conditions? Antithesis may then be decreasing powder charge would decrease vertical distribution.

Who knows?
Sometimes you get the chicken, and sometimes you get the feathers!
Kurt
Posts: 8428
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Not Far enough NW in Illinois

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Kurt »

Shadow 4 wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:00 pm
J.B. wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:51 pm Now now Brian....I think you should re-invent the wheel. I try it every year...and my best result was still with Kurts ammo :shock: Doesn't get much more 'borrowed' than that :oops: You'll just need to adjust the 'menuts' to suit. :wink: :lol:

rgds. Gavin.
'menuts'
:lol: :lol: :lol:
I can tell already, we are not going to be able to shoot together, they're going to have to split us up, we'll never make it, "borrowed" loads or not
Good grief :roll:

Gavin,
Let me tell you a little secret about Brian. He don't borrow rounds he confiscates them :lol: :lol:
Kurt
The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"Winston Churchill
User avatar
Shadow 4
Posts: 456
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:41 pm
Location: BIG SKY COUNTRY

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Shadow 4 »

Kurt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:16 am
Shadow 4 wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:00 pm
J.B. wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:51 pm Now now Brian....I think you should re-invent the wheel. I try it every year...and my best result was still with Kurts ammo :shock: Doesn't get much more 'borrowed' than that :oops: You'll just need to adjust the 'menuts' to suit. :wink: :lol:

rgds. Gavin.
'menuts'
:lol: :lol: :lol:
I can tell already, we are not going to be able to shoot together, they're going to have to split us up, we'll never make it, "borrowed" loads or not
Good grief :roll:

Gavin,
Let me tell you a little secret about Brian. He don't borrow rounds he confiscates them :lol: :lol:
Kurt
I was under orders from Savannah to "confiscate" 200 rounds, & not give them back to him before the start of the match, she said that way Kurt would actually have some left to shoot the match, just following orders :lol:

Gavin,
You'd better be on your game, I'z got those "menuts" figured out :roll:
Cowards rule the world these days.
Coward rules & coward customs
To succeed today, all you've got to know is how to blame & how to complain
Kurt
Posts: 8428
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Not Far enough NW in Illinois

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Kurt »

Shadow 4 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:33 am
Kurt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:16 am
Shadow 4 wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:00 pm

'menuts'
:lol: :lol: :lol:
I can tell already, we are not going to be able to shoot together, they're going to have to split us up, we'll never make it, "borrowed" loads or not
Good grief :roll:

Gavin,
Let me tell you a little secret about Brian. He don't borrow rounds he confiscates them :lol: :lol:
Kurt
I was under orders from Savannah to "confiscate" 200 rounds, & not give them back to him before the start of the match, she said that way Kurt would actually have some left to shoot the match, just following orders :lol:

Gavin,
You'd better be on your game, I'z got those "menuts" figured out :roll:

The only reason I let you take 200 rounds is because I have respect for that Gal because she can shoot better then me :lol: :lol:
The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"Winston Churchill
User avatar
Shadow 4
Posts: 456
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:41 pm
Location: BIG SKY COUNTRY

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Shadow 4 »

Kurt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:48 am
Shadow 4 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:33 am
Kurt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:16 am


Gavin,
Let me tell you a little secret about Brian. He don't borrow rounds he confiscates them :lol: :lol:
Kurt
I was under orders from Savannah to "confiscate" 200 rounds, & not give them back to him before the start of the match, she said that way Kurt would actually have some left to shoot the match, just following orders :lol:

Gavin,
You'd better be on your game, I'z got those "menuts" figured out :roll:

The only reason I let you take 200 rounds is because I have respect for that Gal because she can shoot better then me :lol: :lol:
She still shakes her head about it
She says you have no discipline when it comes to pacing yourself :lol:
Cowards rule the world these days.
Coward rules & coward customs
To succeed today, all you've got to know is how to blame & how to complain
Kurt
Posts: 8428
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Not Far enough NW in Illinois

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Kurt »

Shadow 4 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:40 pm
Kurt wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:48 am
Shadow 4 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:33 am

I was under orders from Savannah to "confiscate" 200 rounds, & not give them back to him before the start of the match, she said that way Kurt would actually have some left to shoot the match, just following orders :lol:

Gavin,
You'd better be on your game, I'z got those "menuts" figured out :roll:

The only reason I let you take 200 rounds is because I have respect for that Gal because she can shoot better then me :lol: :lol:
She still shakes her head about it
She says you have no discipline when it comes to pacing yourself :lol:

Hey, I was young once also so I do know what lack of discipline is :lol: :lol:

Hey I will see y'all in June and we will have a talk :lol: :lol:
The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"Winston Churchill
User avatar
J.B.
Posts: 644
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 10:31 pm
Location: Australia

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by J.B. »

Gavin,
Let me tell you a little secret about Brian. He don't borrow rounds he confiscates them :lol: :lol:
Kurt
[/quote]

... Well that might work if he confiscates mine...and gives me yours in return. I can't vouch for mine though. Being the same chambering might be handy too :wink: See you both in June

Gavin.
"an experimental weapon..with experimental ammunition ? ...Lets experiment "
Kurt
Posts: 8428
Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Not Far enough NW in Illinois

Re: Ladder Loads - How do you properly conduct this test/process?

Post by Kurt »

J.B. wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:29 pm Gavin,
Let me tell you a little secret about Brian. He don't borrow rounds he confiscates them :lol: :lol:
Kurt
... Well that might work if he confiscates mine...and gives me yours in return. I can't vouch for mine though. Being the same chambering might be handy too :wink: See you both in June

Gavin.
[/quote]


If he comes around next time I will have two boxes filled with gravel and give him that. He won't tell the difference in the sound if he shakes them. :lol:
The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"Winston Churchill
Post Reply