405 Winchester vs 40-70 SS

[Glen Ring]

IF I decide to purchase a rifle in 40-70 SS, can I use 405 Winchester brass to load the BP rounds??

[Clarence]

Glen,

Depends on how your rifle is chambered.

First, it's 0.080" long so must be trimmed to 2.500" or so, depending on the depth of your chamber.

Second, the brass is thicker than historical .40-70 SS brass, and there were reports that bullet diameter of 0.408" or more could not be chambers chambered earlier by Shiloh unless the brass was neck-turned.

Some custom rifle makers chambered with a reamer designed specifically for the Hornady brass. My .40-70 SS (a Rolling Block) is so chambered. My 1991-vintage RCBS dies are perfect, reducing the diameter just a couple of thousandths for controlling neck tension. I can chamber a 0.409" bullet without problems.

I've heard rumors that Shiloh will chamber for the Hornady brass. It would be best to talk with Kirk to confirm that.

Incidentally, I use a Shiloh in-line seater, which has been opened up with the same reamer that cut my chamber. It works very well, but you should be aware that Kirk always recommends a bullet of nominal diameter and cuts the seater for a 0.408" bullet, so you'll either need a mould that isn't oversize from the nominal diameter or to size your bullets to 0.408".

Clarence

[Don McDowell]

If the rim recess is cut for it yes you can
Probably better run down a supply of brass first since they don’t make it any more

[John Bly]

I've got a fairly new Shiloh in 40/70SS. Getting the correct brass took me a while. The stretched Krag brass from BACO was in short supply for quite a while. I initially bought some used stretched Krag brass but it had the standard rim. I sold it and bought new stretched Krag brass from Baco with the correct rim. In the meantime I picked up some used 405 brass to try in it. The brass had been neck turned but not far enough back for the bullet I was using. I had to neck turn it again farther back so it would chamber. Also many of the cases would not chamber after full length sizing because they were too big right in front of the rim. Another set up on the lathe corrected this and each case had to be tried in the chamber to make sure it fit. The rim thickness was not a problem. The 405 cases needed to be sorted by weight also as there was about 10 grains variance in weight. I now have about 350 good cases ready for action.

I have a reamer for the 40/70 to use the 405 brass but I didn't want to use it on my new Shiloh as it would void the warranty. It would also make the chamber too big in the neck area for the Krag brass. So there you have it, yes you can use 405 brass but it may take some work. One other point, unturned 405 brass will work for paper patch bullets.

[VectorMan]

IF I decide to purchase a rifle in 40-70 SS, can I use 405 Winchester brass to load the BP rounds??

Good luck finding the brass.

[Glen Ring]

I better stick with my 40-65 and 45-70 Thanks guys

[art ruggiero]

chamber it in 40/82 shiloh my shoots great using resized starline 45/90 brass art

[DeadEye]

Glen, there are four different 40-82 chamberings that I know of, make sure you do your homework and decide which one suits your needs.

Paul

[bpcr shooter]

Dad just had Arnie design him a bullet for 40-82 silhouette, 45-90 sized down and trimmed back, were still working on a load but it shoots pretty darn good. recoil is very little with a 34in barrel.

[kenny sd]

I have a two year old 40 70 SS Shiloh and use the BA Krag brass with no trouble.
I load 65 1 1/2 Swiss and the BA 400 grain GG or a custom 420 PP with BA paper.
many reloads, little or no stretching, no sizing at all.

it shoots inside of an inch at 100 IF I do my part. two inches or less is usual.

No problem with the historically correct calibre....Ken

[TAA]

My Model 74 chambered in 40-70SS is 10-years old. I told them ahead of time what brass I woukd be using, Hornady 405. That is the only brass I've used. When new all that is needed is to trim the brass to the correct length. Cases have never been full length sized. Am now embarking on PP DD (DD thanks to Beltfed Arnie) bullets and things look promising!

Tom

[hepburnman]

Not sure the 40-70 buys you much over the 40-65. I use 70 gr of Swiss in my cases and a 429 gr bullet. I do have 0.200" of freebore but I also like a fair amount of bullet in the case. My powder compression is about 0.320" but it all depends on what you want to do.

The 40-65 is also very easy to get to shoot well and you could either use Starline 40-65 brass or form your own from 45-70 brass.

[august west]

IF I decide to purchase a rifle in 40-70 SS, can I use 405 Winchester brass to load the BP rounds??

Good luck finding the brass.

Oddly enough no shortage of .405 Winchester ammo out there - you could buy it and break it down and sell the bullets. Or let a friend with a .405 shoot it all up. Or buy an 1895!

[bruce m]

Not sure the 40-70 buys you much over the 40-65. I use 70 gr of Swiss in my cases and a 429 gr bullet. I do have 0.200" of freebore but I also like a fair amount of bullet in the case. My powder compression is about 0.320" but it all depends on what you want to do.

The 40-65 is also very easy to get to shoot well and you could either use Starline 40-65 brass or form your own from 45-70 brass.

in the day the 40/70 was often loade with 65 gns, and was often known as the 40/65.
bruce.

[Don McDowell]

IF I decide to purchase a rifle in 40-70 SS, can I use 405 Winchester brass to load the BP rounds??

Good luck finding the brass.

Oddly enough no shortage of .405 Winchester ammo out there - you could buy it and break it down and sell the bullets. Or let a friend with a .405 shoot it all up. Or buy an 1895!

Where are you seeing 405 ammo in stock? At 55$ per box of 20, it's a pretty speedy deal to come up with 200 rounds of empty brass...