2F Test

[ian45662]

I got out to the range to test the 2F swiss yesterday. I was expecting it to like some compression but that may not be the case with my rifles. I started with the 83 grain load I had made and it was.....MEH...... went to the 85 and it was getting worse. I put the 81 grain loads on paper and things started looking good. When I was loading these I had 5 pieces of empty brass left so I just decided to load them with 79 grains just to see...... I wish I had loaded more. I will be visiting that load again. I used federal large pistol primers for this experiment. I shot these 2 groups out of my highwall but my Shiloh gave very similar results. The only difference is that I used Rifle primers in the shiloh and the groups were larger probably because of that. My Shiloh does like pistol primers over rifle primers but I wanted to at least test the rifle primers.

[ian45662]

In other news I figured out how to post pictures!! I have to do it from my computer and not my phone.

[SSShooter]

Similar results with 2F in my 40-65. It is quite accurate with 65gr of 2F Swiss with a 440gr BACo Money bullet but accuracy falls off rapidly with more powder, which means more compression. By the time it is up to 68gr it is shooting more of a 'pattern' than a group.

[kenny sd]

tell me about using pistol primers...
don't they tend to damage the sharps block?
do they fit the 40 70 SS cases?

I use Reg Rifle primers with success. not sure if this will change things..Ken

[SSShooter]

LP primers fit any case a LR primer fits. They are a bit shorter, so they do back out into the block-face when fired. However, with modern steels (will guess that Shiloh uses 8620 for its receiver & parts - can be cast, machines reasonably well & takes case-color & bluing very nicely) it would take many, many (as in several 10s of thou or more) rounds to harm the block-face.

[ian45662]

I use construction paper to head space the pistol primer.

[Kurt]

ian you have to be careful cutting heavy paper under the primer in the pocket. I did this once with my .45-90 Shiloh and the heavy paper blew the flame back past the primer and put deep gas cuts on the breach block face.

Hey, some time when we are at Alma you and I will have to get together. I need too pick your brain on your fine vittels you make in the smoker and grills. Fine looking eats

[ian45662]

Is it gas cutting that causes the damage or is it the primer slamming into the breach block or is it a combination? I have shot some really good groups with this Shiloh using pistol primers. I quit for a little while for fear of the breach block thing but I’m pretty much at the point now where if it needs repaired after a while then I will just pay for the repair. I have not shot more than probably 6 or 700 pistol primers out of it but I can’t find any sign of any damage. Kurt you can come on down to the Bluegrass Steel Challenge. There is a good chance that I will he doing the cooking for our dinner but I am always happy to talk about cooking

[rgchristensen]

I have shot ca. 12-14000 pistol primers from a Browning 40-65 with no apparent distress to the face of the block.
CHRIS

[Raven]

Similar results with 2F in my 40-65. It is quite accurate with 65gr of 2F Swiss with a 440gr BACo Money bullet but accuracy falls off rapidly with more powder, which means more compression. By the time it is up to 68gr it is shooting more of a 'pattern' than a group.

I am seeing similar results with 530 Postell over 65gn S2f (1.5 MOA) going way off at 68gn S2F in 45-70 Sporter 1.

Thanks just looking for similarities with Swiss 2F.

[Raven]

Similar results with 2F in my 40-65. It is quite accurate with 65gr of 2F Swiss with a 440gr BACo Money bullet but accuracy falls off rapidly with more powder, which means more compression. By the time it is up to 68gr it is shooting more of a 'pattern' than a group.

I am seeing similar results with 530 Postell over 65gn S2f (1.5 MOA) going way off at 68gn S2F in 45-70 Sporter 1.

Thanks just looking for similarities with Swiss 2F.

IMG_0264.jpeg

[Kurt]

Is it gas cutting that causes the damage or is it the primer slamming into the breach block or is it a combination? I have shot some really good groups with this Shiloh using pistol primers. I quit for a little while for fear of the breach block thing but I’m pretty much at the point now where if it needs repaired after a while then I will just pay for the repair. I have not shot more than probably 6 or 700 pistol primers out of it but I can’t find any sign of any damage. Kurt you can come on down to the Bluegrass Steel Challenge. There is a good chance that I will he doing the cooking for our dinner but I am always happy to talk about cooking

Gas cutting Ian. This is a Stevens breach block and I have a Shiloh block that is just about as bad.

IMG_3084.jpeg

[SSShooter]

Where do you guys get all these 'leaky' primers? With my hottest F-Class loads I get an occasional pierced primer during testing, but never with BP. Is that result of bad primer pockets? I'm thinking if you've got leakage then you need new cases.

[ian45662]

How long did it take for that to happen?

[Woody]

Is that result of bad primer pockets? I'm thinking if you've got leakage then you need new cases.

I'm with Glenn.

The few times I've pierced primers, the cause was not the type of primer, but the firing pin. Either too long, improperly shaped, or not properly fitted to the firing pin hole. When a primer is pierced, the tip of the pin is eroded and will usually cause additional piercing and more tip erosion, etc. The gas cutting erosion that Kurt is showing, is the result of gas leaking around the primer pocket, when the primer does not seal.

Woody