38-55

[Shadow 4]

C Sharps 1874 38-55
30" Barrel 15 twist 16?
Winchester brass annealed
.060 Walters Wad
Fed 210M Primer
335gr Lyman 16/1
Seated out 1st Grease Groove
42 or 44grs 3F
Compression?
FPS?
ES?
SD?

Both Savannah and Alissah started on this rifle.
Recoil is a non issue.
Used for both pasture gong and BPCR gong silhouette shoots.
Alissah rang exactly zero rams.
Unaware of how much powder and which F most others use, not sure if 44grs 3f is on the upper end or not.
Some rams tipped slow, centered up, shots in the ass and frt shoulder were better placement.

40-65 does work better, heavier bullet.
Less wind deflection.
Centered up tip slow also.

Successfully Shooting and calling wind (38-55) for a couple of years will make you a better spotter and your grandson a better marksman, in the long run. That, afterall, is the objective, a superior marksman.

Then should the move up to a 40-65, (sure easy to make shoot well & lots of availability) be next, the time spent perfecting sight picture, trigger control and follow through on that 38 will be immediately apparent.

Recently, I & others, not shooting a 38-55, had our asses handed to us, out to 875yds, she told me that she won it because of her spotter. If a spotter can be made out of you and you can get your grandson to do what his competent spotter tells him, you and him will have a wonderful time, like Penny and myself & girls are.

Good luck with that, girls listen to their spotters, boys don't, they think they know everything already. I remember those days

BTW, Savannah moved up to a 40-65, & now a 45-70.
Alissah has moved up to the 40-65 .
All is well

Become proficient with the 38-55, damn the rest, then move up after you should have, rather than before you should.

Patience is advised
Reward is higher

[powderburnt]

Finally, a voice of practical experience.10-4 on girls listen and boys don't, I'm 66 and still have that problem of doing as my spotter says.

HG

[Glen Ring]

Now THAT is what I was looking for !! That kind of response is what these forums should all be about.
If we shoot any of the same matches next summer, please introduce yourself to us.
I'll be the Klingon looking fellow with a pretty woman and a handsome grandson and I'll surely owe you your choice of beverage for relaying that info to me.
Thank you
Glen Ring

[Marlin3855]

Glenn,
Both Ashlea and myself have used a 38-55 highwall for Silhouette. As has been mentioned reading wind really matters!
I prefer to use my 40-65 these days but still use a 38 every now and again. Ashlea didnt like the 40-65 so went back to 38-55.
We have stood the very occasional ram but in the next relay a guy with a 40-65 did as well.
My load is a 320g Baco money bullet, 50g Swiss 2f, .030" walters poly wad and a heap of compression. The guns we were using are original Winchester highwalls with factory (round 1 in 18")twist so a heavier bullet is not doable.

Dave McCarthy

[John Bly]

Glad to see we got back on track.

[Glen Ring]

Thank you gents...yep...back on track helping each other. ..I need all the help I can get with my wife and grandson both being much smarter than myself.

[ian45662]

At our last shoot my name was drawn to get something from the prize table. One of the prizes left was a 100 dollar gift card for a green mountain barrel. I have been seriously considering picking up a fast twist 38 barrel for my cpa.

[martinibelgian]

Basically, in order to be competitive with a .38, you need to have a bullet with an identical BC as let's say a 45-70. This means a faster than normal twist is required to sufficiently stabilize the heavier bullet. Once these primary conditions have been met and you're shooting a bullet with an identical BC at the same MV, there won't be any difference in wind drift.
Unfortunately, most factory barrels won't stabilize the bullets required, so .... Same for the .40's at long range. Of course, 38-55 is a bit capacity-challenged, so maybe a prime candiate for bore-dia. PP? Any takers? I do believe Dan T once designed both chamber and bullet for the cartridge with heavier bullet and faster twist...

[SSShooter]

A couple of us 38-55 shooters are loading 49gr of 1.5F or 2F Swiss behind the BACo 360gr Money bullet. Occasional rung ram, just like 40cal & 45cal shooters. Loading for the 38-55 is just like any other BP cartridge. Takes some work to find what your rifle shoots well (powder, compression, bullet, primer, etc.). The 38cal is, as stated above, 'tender'. Consistency of hold & follow-thru are, in my experience, considerably more critical than with the 40-65. Any small slip results in a large change in POI.
Am experimenting with the BACo 345gr DDPP bullet in my 12" twist barrel and initial indications are positive. May try BACo's 360gr DDPP bullet, as well, though it could be a bit long for a 12" twist.

[powderburnt]

Funny you should mention the Dan T designed 38 caliber. I'm on it. He did two as far as I know, one for 38-55 and another for 38-50 Hepburn. A fellow shooter acquired a reamer for the 38-50 Hepburn about 6 years ago and built 2 rifles, one on a High Wall action for his self and another on a Stevens 44 1/2 for another friend. Both rifles shot great with greasers for 40 to 50 rounds in a match then would lead up terribly. After a couple years of off and on trials they were determined to not be worth the trouble because the fouling was to difficult to control. I ended up with the High Wall and another friend with the Stevens. I found that I could do no better with greasers and made a made a small attempt at bore diameter PP bullets. Results were disappointing so I set it aside for a couple of years. As I have said before, several shooters got my interest in PP again with the dual diameter bullet and I took a leap of faith and it's been paper patch all the way once I got my 40-65 going. The next project was a .45 DDPP for a friend and it has proven very capable in his 45-70 and my 45-90. I got the High Wall 38-50 H out and had Steve Brooks cut a DDPP for it, 1.45 long and 373 gr. in 16-1 DDPP. The barrel is a GM 12 twist. I have been to the range twice with it and have put 100 rounds through it. Velocity is at 1300 fps with 64 1/2 gr of 3f Swiss and 10fps less with the same charge of 1 1/2 Swiss. At 300m it is holding better than 1 moa vertical with several groups. Both days at the range was breezy with a 5-8 mph wind from 1-3 o'clock and second trip, 5-10 mph from 6-3 o'clock. Today's forecast is clear and calm so I'm headed to the range for a little more refinement and determine which powder works best. If there is interest, I'll start another thread with results and more specifics.

HG

[SSShooter]

Harlan - that would great. Look forward to your new thread and 38cal PP results.

[martinibelgian]

Talk about a fast twist - my 32-20 has the same 1 in 12 twist, and that is considered fast for the round FWIW, my experience is that fouling management is of paramount importance with the smaller bores: patch thickness, amount of moisture in the patches, patch size,... When you get it wrong, accuracy goes to hell. When you get it right, you're shooting ragged holes...

And as to a similar experience, had the same with my 45-70 - kept the 1st 7 shots into 3.5 MOA (a bit less actually) at 300 meters (Thats prone, sling only, unsupported), and then accuracy deteriorated. Still trying to determine why, but I'm assuming the tight-fitting patch used for wiping between shots left the barrel too clean (not enough lube remaing for the next shot), which led to a gradual buildup of leading. This was with GG bullets, BTW. The cleanup after shooting did indeed show leading in the barrel.

[ian45662]

Would anyone happen to have a print for the 38-55 and 50 reamer? If I got a 38 it would be paper patch all the way. Fast twist bore diameter bullet . Correct my if I am wrong but Dan T thought that the 38 had some major potential

[Glen Ring]

The 38-55 I'm looking at has a 1-15 twist and is a badger barrel. 38-55 Winchester " short' or factory brass. Now if my grandson is shooting this the worst thing that can happen is someone tell him it's not a good caliber for silhouette. Of course we only hang around encouraging, nice people . We've all had that know it all fellow who we just met , come up and say " you'll never do any good with that.'

[45bpcr]

I'll wade in here.

I had 38-55 built for my wife.
A C-Sharps 1885.

My apologies Kirk for posting on your board about a brand you don't produce.

I talked to Dan-T about small caliber,heavy bullet BPCR bullets.
I talked with Kermit about the same thing one day at Ridgway.
They both recommended different chamberings.

I wanted a soft shooting rifle for Carolyn.

I had C-Sharps make me an 1885.
It has a 1-12 twist Green Mountain barrel that's 28 inches long.
Half octagon, half round.
A single set trigger.
A Hoke rear sight and Shaver PH series front sight.

I tested 2 different bullets, both from BACO moulds.
Never did have much luck with the "Money Bullet" in that rifle.
I figure Kidwell is still pissed at Yankees.

The Creedmoor bullet shoots very well.
I seat it a bit long and use a little bit of neck tension.
Starline long brass.
41 grains of Swiss 1 1/2
CCI BR-2 and a .060 wad.
The bullet is just shy of the lands and she has to wipe between shots.

Somewhere there's a youtube video of her doing her first grand slam on rams.