Use Those Antiques

Share your tales (tall or otherwise) of hunting adventures.

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JWL
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Location: Moose Lake, MN

Use Those Antiques

Post by JWL »

Remember it's not the size of the deer you shoot that matters, it's about the gun you use. If I couldn't use a Shiloh or an original antique to hunt with I wouldn't hunt at all.
The first pic. is of me and my Sharps Borchardt Sporter, after being sold by JP Lower someone shortened the heavy round barrel to 24" and lengthened the chamber to 2.31". The load I'm using in this neat old gun is 82 gr. of Swiss 1.5, Grease Cookie, 450gr. .444 PP Bullet and a CCI LR Primer.
Pic. #2 is my attempt to prove to my friends that people don't need a huge, oversized magnum to kill a MN Whitetail, after all there was a time when 44-40's and smaller cartidges were responsible for taking more deer in this counrty than anything. The gun in this pic. is a '89 Marlin in 44-40 loaded with 34.5 gr. of Swiss 1.5, no wad and a 200gr. 20/1 .429 bullet.

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I collect guns, but if I can't hunt with it I don't want it.
Stephen Borud
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by Stephen Borud »

Nice work. I like it.

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Don McDowell
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by Don McDowell »

Yessir , that's the way to do it. Nice work. :)
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Ken Heier
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by Ken Heier »

Neat, Nice rifles! Thanks for sharing.
Ken
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rdnck
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by rdnck »

I like it---a lot. Congratulations on the deer and for giving the rifles a new lease on life. Shoot straight, rdnck.
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John Bly
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by John Bly »

Thanks for the pictures and info. I heartily agree with you on using our older guns.

I have a Winchester 94 in 38/55 that was made in 1919. In 1999 I took it hunting for it's 80th birthday and I killed a deer with it. My son used it in 2009 but was not able to make meat with it. I've been carrying an original 1895 Marlin in 45/70 in hopes to kill a deer with it but no luck so far. My old eyes can't see those sights well in dim light and most deer are seen early in the AM or late evening. I carried an 1882 Maynard several years ago in 45/70. I had a deer get in close one evening and when I tried to line up the sights on it the deer just disappeared. I could see the deer while not looking at the sights and I could see the sights while not looking at the deer but I just could not put them together. I had to pass it up.

I like taking my old guns for a walk. I think it does us both some good. I just picked up a very nice 1897 Marlin .22 and I think some fox squirrels and us have a date in the near future.
"Perfection consists not so much in doing extraordinary things as in doing ordinary things extraordinarily well"
5090
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Location: Washington

Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by 5090 »

I am in total agreement. Any game animal is a trophy when taken with antique firearms and open sights. Very nicely done.
dm3280
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by dm3280 »

Speaking of damascus shotguns, you go into any gun shop and they have a cow if you say you want to shoot a damascus shotgun. I have a Baker that was restored by a world known gunsmith who specializes in damascus shotguns. He told me as long as it is a quality gun by a known maker and in good shape he had no issues. He showed me a Parker that the barrels looked like a gravel road. He has shot the equivalent of a magnum load through it trying to get it to burst and to date nothing.
Brent
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by Brent »

Yup, Damascus is good stuff...
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Bad Bill
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by Bad Bill »

Yep, they are beautiful guns> Beautiful to the eye and pleasant to the touch. They are also laminated steel; often with tiny air pockets and micro-pockets of rust. Best not to even try to shoot one UNTIL it has been examined by a gunsmith competent in examining said guns. Sad, but true :cry:
"Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free." John 8:32
mdeland
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by mdeland »

I have some pictures around here somewhere of inclusions found in Damascus barrels and even the best are full of them yet the laminations in a spiral gives them good hoop strength which is the major stress in firearm barrels; the problem as I understand it is the tensile strength length wise on the forge welds connecting the spiral laminations.
That is the reason in construction that lap welds are used instead of butt welds when tension is the major stressing. In Damascus barrels all the spirals are butt welded, as it were, to each other and the welds are full of inclusions, the better makes having less and hence more strength. MD
bobw
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by bobw »

John Boy wrote:Might add because the edit function of the forum software is hosed ... I test my Damascus shotguns every month at the CAS matches. Twenty five rounds each time - 85gr FFg & 1 1/8 shot. So far, so good! :D

The duck loads are 95gr FFFg and 1 1/4 shot
"Finding out for myself" Sherman Bell DGJ. Was an excellent if recall correctly article ,only thing I didn't like about it was of course destroying a beautiful Parker. :( As I also remember there just about no comparison between the Damascus steel barrels and twist steel ones. bobw
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dm3280
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by dm3280 »

Briley use to sell, and may still do so, barrel inserts. They advertised them as take you grandfathers gun out of the closet and use their barrel inserts to shoot the gun again. It does change the gauge to a smaller one. If you have a shotgun but just not comfortable shooting it try calling Brliey about their inserts.
dm3280
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by dm3280 »

I may have it wrong but I thought i heard or was told somewhere that they way they proof test a barrel is to shoot it with special loads and then measure certain points on the barrel to see if there is any expansion. I know that if a barrel unwraps or explodes this is a sign or barrel expansion but before it get to that point couldn't someone use the tire method but measure the barrel before and after the shot?

As far as voids in the wraps I had mine x-rayed buy a company that x-rays building foundations. I believe it cost me $15. it did show small voids midway down the barrel. They were rather small. I could not see them until the guy who did the x-ray pointed them out.
dm3280
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Re: Use Those Antiques

Post by dm3280 »

One more thought. One area I do not see anyone talking about for vintage shotguns that also can cause issues is not just the barrel material but the chamber length. Every old shotgun I have had that I shot I first take to my gunsmith and have him check the chamber length and modify to modern measurements as needed. I was told that most old shotguns originally shot shells that were shorter in length than modern ones. When a modern shell, regardless of what it is loaded with, opens the shell length is longer than the chamber. This will cause a rise is chamber pressure since the shell cannot open all the way. I am not sure when gun makers started making the current chamber lengths but I am sure someone here will know.

I do find it odd that the gun shops I have been to are more than happy to sell me a damascus shotgun and never a word of shooting it. The second I bring one in they run for the hills. I also have never had a gun shop warn me of the chamber length of an old shotgun and the need to have it checked.
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