breach sleeve

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kenny sd
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breach sleeve

Post by kenny sd » Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:52 pm

Does the original Sharps 1863 carbine have a floating breach sleeve?

Tomklinger
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by Tomklinger » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:09 pm

Yes, I’ve seen them missing and loose also.....as well as in the model ‘59 carbine and rifle, and also the ‘52 and ‘53 slant breach
Tom K

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kenny sd
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by kenny sd » Mon Jun 29, 2020 6:04 am

Thanks Tom, I thought so...
I just bought a 63 percussion carbine and I'm cleaning it up. I'd like to get the sleeve loose and get some oil it in. I've ordered a chamber sleeve remover from Taylor, so I'll go easy and see. If it is too tight, it will stay there. but for $12, I thought I*'d give it a go.

Ken

George Babits
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by George Babits » Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:00 am

My original carbine has a chamber sleeve too. I can feel a little gap in the forward part of the chamber. I haven't tried to move it, nor have I yet shot the carbine. I think I'll just shoot it and see what happens. The gas check plate on the block is tight, but I have been able to get it off. Took some doing as they don't have the little slots on the sides like the Shiloh does.

George

Tomklinger
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by Tomklinger » Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:50 pm

Kenny,
You may want to soak the area in Kroil for a few days while you’re waiting for your puller.....
Tom

Kirk
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by Kirk » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:11 am

I have had a lot of originals come through the shop and they never left the factory with removeable sleeves. These ones you guys are talking about have
obviously been repaired at one time or another, as we do here. Even the repaired ones shouldn't come out or move. It's the gas plate's job to do the sealing. I have yet to figure out why you would want the chamber to be moving around in one of these...

Just my two cents,,
Kirk

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kenny sd
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by kenny sd » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:13 am

Kirk, thanks. I thought that too. I'm going to leave it alone...really nice gun, great shape. leave it BE..
Ken

George Babits
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by George Babits » Tue Jul 07, 2020 7:43 am

I'm no expert on the original percussion Sharps, but I have to disagree with Kirk on the chamber "sleeve" in the originals. From what I have been reading in Frank Sellers book, and an older book on the Sharps by Martin Rywell, the originals did indeed have a movable "sleeve" in the chamber. It was referred to as a "bouching" and its purpose was to set the headspace. This was done with a special tool that "clamped" onto the front of the bouching and then was driven back against the gas check plate with a rod from the muzzle. The bouching, or sleeve if you prefer, was NOT supposed to move with the firing of the rifle. The movable part, which seals the breech, is the gas check plate. The sleeve, when worn, could be driven back to re-set the headspace. In most originals you should be able to feel the front of the bouching with a small dental pick or something like that. I don't think it matters much if you can't move one now. I would guess that if you are getting a lot of gas leakage on firing, that you might try to loosen it up and drive it back. I have no idea if the Taylor chamber tool is anything close to what the original "bouching" tool might have been.

Having said all that, I would agree with Kirk that the Shiloh percussion Sharps do not, nor ever did, have a chamber sleeve (bouching).

George

Tomklinger
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by Tomklinger » Tue Jul 07, 2020 2:15 pm

Thanks George,
I’ve read the same thing.....
Tom

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kenny sd
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by kenny sd » Wed Jul 08, 2020 4:51 am

me too, I received the Taylor tool, tried it gently and it did nothing. and so will I..
case closed.
I also heard about the original sharps having a chamber that would be able to be set back when worn.
Ken

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kenny sd
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by kenny sd » Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:02 am

thanks George. I went through a SCA magazine about the 1850 and early Sharps...they did indeed have a movable boucheing .
it was meant to correct the 'headspace' when necessary. it did not move on firing. a special tool was needed as you said.

question is...did the early percussion US guns have such a boucheing? probably not.

Ken

George Babits
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by George Babits » Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:01 am

I've never made a study of other breech loading percussion rifles, but I don't think any of the others had a movable sleeve like the Sharps did.

George

Kirk
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Re: breach sleeve

Post by Kirk » Fri Jul 10, 2020 1:03 pm

The early slants and that type of Sharps did have a sleeve, they even put what they called a platinum ring on the breach face to try and get them to seal. When it comes to the 59's and 63's, I have never seen one through all of the years. I have 7 of the carbines and 3 banders and there is no sleeve in any of them. The one three band that I have I believe was never issued, it is in pristine condition, and there is no sleeve. The cone shaped I.D. of the gas plate is designed to move forward when fired to seal it up.

Kirk,

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