While I know it's a pain in the neck to clean a '63, I've started using a method which cuts some time off the procedure. A friend has been using this method on his cap and ball Colt for years with good results.
Clean the bore in the normal way, patches, brushes etc.
Take out the breech block and brush the face of the barrel and the leaver spring area by the under side of the forearm with an old tooth brush covered with your cleaning solution and then slightly wipe dry.
Remove the nipple and gas seal plate on the breech block and then run the whole thing under water from the hose. Use the brush to get the fouling out and to clean the nipple and breech area for the nipple.
Using a small air compresser, blow all water from the breech block, getting the air down into the nipple hole and the cone by the gas seal. Also, blow out the face of the barrel and that part of the action.
Once dry, spray your favorite oil over and through the breech and barrel face. Then use the compressed air to blow off the oil.
Now, wipe all parts with your oily rag, grease the action parts and reassemble.
The water gets the fouling out of places it's hard to get a patch into and the compressed air blows the action/block dry. Then, using the spray oil, you get into all areas of the action and then by spraying the oil out, you will only be able to spray out the excess oil, but still leave an oily film on the metal.
This probably cuts my clening time by 25% but I think it does a better job then just using cleaning patches and brushes. I use a small Sears/Home Depot air compressor that generated a max of 130psi.
Rich
PS, I had thought very seriously about selling the Shiloh 63' Sharps and getting a Romano 1st Model Maynard for my N-SSA competition because the Maynard has a tang sight (used on the issue guns in the Civil War and legal for N-SSA matches) and a 26" barrel. The Maynard is also very simple to clean and uses brass cases, no paper cases to make. But then I thought about the cost of the Romano carbine, $2500, the cost of the cartridge cases, $2 each, and the need to clean the cases after firing. I guess I've changed my mind, especially after my carbine did well for me at the Fall Nationals. No metals but just good shooting.
The dreaded cleaning of the '63
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Rich Siegel
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gmartin
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Hi Rich,
Glad you did well at Nationals. (and didn't rid yourself of that '63)
Guess what? I use an air compreser as well. For similar uses as well. I differ in that I soak my entire action in very hot water on the stove as I clean the bore, the area about the lever spring, etc. Then when the action is worked upon the final process is using the compressor to insure coverage of cleaning solution, preservative oil, and of course to aid in drying out hard to reach areas.
I'm experimenting with an auto anti seize for the threads and gas seal, but find find that stuff incredibly messy, am guarded as to its overall efficacy.
Thanks, Gregg
Glad you did well at Nationals. (and didn't rid yourself of that '63)
Guess what? I use an air compreser as well. For similar uses as well. I differ in that I soak my entire action in very hot water on the stove as I clean the bore, the area about the lever spring, etc. Then when the action is worked upon the final process is using the compressor to insure coverage of cleaning solution, preservative oil, and of course to aid in drying out hard to reach areas.
I'm experimenting with an auto anti seize for the threads and gas seal, but find find that stuff incredibly messy, am guarded as to its overall efficacy.
Thanks, Gregg
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Todd Birch
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'63 cleaning shortcuts
I turned down an otherwise pristine '63 Farmingdale carbine in .45 (believe it or not) as the owner had been too lazy to do a complete stripping of the breech block after firing. He admitted to me later he didn't know how to do it.
He managed to snap off the head of the flash hole clean out screw which isn't an easily over come problem and continued to shoot the rifle occasionally afterwards.
The use of automotive anti-seize compound isn't a problem. Just don't put it on with a popsicle stick.
Todd
He managed to snap off the head of the flash hole clean out screw which isn't an easily over come problem and continued to shoot the rifle occasionally afterwards.
The use of automotive anti-seize compound isn't a problem. Just don't put it on with a popsicle stick.
Todd
"From birth to the packing house, we travel between the two eternities ....." Robert Duvall in "Broken Trail"
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Kelley O. Roos
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Jim Mulligan
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Hi Rich,
Glad to hear of your success at the nationals. I purchased a used Romano 1st model Maynard at the nationals. I have not had the opportunity to shoot it. It is a nice carbine and I like it but I think Shiloh is better quality. I purchasd some of the vinyl tubes from the Winchester Sutler and will try them out to save time making ammo.
Jim
Glad to hear of your success at the nationals. I purchased a used Romano 1st model Maynard at the nationals. I have not had the opportunity to shoot it. It is a nice carbine and I like it but I think Shiloh is better quality. I purchasd some of the vinyl tubes from the Winchester Sutler and will try them out to save time making ammo.
Jim
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Rich Siegel
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Jim,
Sorry we didn't see each other at the Nationals. I read on the N-SSA board that you bought the Maynard. Let me know how things work out. While I don't think the wood to metal fit is as good as a Shiloh, the metal work seems to be of high quality and the long barrel and tang sight should be a great aid in accuracy. As I said, I've thought about the Maynard many times but each time I get serious, the Sharps does it's work. I even bought a Shiloh '74 military carbine in 30/40 to practice with as well as hunt with. I'm still having a challenging time getting it to shoot lead bullets but that's another story.
Eric Schuessler makes his own tubes out of brass for an original 2nd model Maynard so if you run into trouble with the plastic tubes, you might want to give him a shout. He also makes a reproduction of the original bullet seating tool for the Maynard.
Gregg,
The Civil War vintage Maynards use a brass cartridge case to hold powder and bullet, just like a modern centerfire cartridge but there was no primer in the case, just a hole. The case has a very large rim, sticking out much more over the diameter of the body. When the action was closed, a percussion cap is placed on the nipple on the outside of the action and the hammer pulled back and dropped to fire the round (just like the Sharps). The Maynard action is much like a modern single shot shotgun where the barrel rotates 45 degrees down to load. When the barrel is returned to battery, there is about a 1/16" gap between the barrel and action. The cartridge case rim sticks out of this gap, making the action air-tight and sealing the action. After firing, the barrel is rotated down and you grab the big cartridge rim with your fingers to extract the case. Folks have realized that plastic will work just/almost as good as brass for the cartridge case and costs much less. They also don't need to cleaned after each firing.
Rich
Sorry we didn't see each other at the Nationals. I read on the N-SSA board that you bought the Maynard. Let me know how things work out. While I don't think the wood to metal fit is as good as a Shiloh, the metal work seems to be of high quality and the long barrel and tang sight should be a great aid in accuracy. As I said, I've thought about the Maynard many times but each time I get serious, the Sharps does it's work. I even bought a Shiloh '74 military carbine in 30/40 to practice with as well as hunt with. I'm still having a challenging time getting it to shoot lead bullets but that's another story.
Eric Schuessler makes his own tubes out of brass for an original 2nd model Maynard so if you run into trouble with the plastic tubes, you might want to give him a shout. He also makes a reproduction of the original bullet seating tool for the Maynard.
Gregg,
The Civil War vintage Maynards use a brass cartridge case to hold powder and bullet, just like a modern centerfire cartridge but there was no primer in the case, just a hole. The case has a very large rim, sticking out much more over the diameter of the body. When the action was closed, a percussion cap is placed on the nipple on the outside of the action and the hammer pulled back and dropped to fire the round (just like the Sharps). The Maynard action is much like a modern single shot shotgun where the barrel rotates 45 degrees down to load. When the barrel is returned to battery, there is about a 1/16" gap between the barrel and action. The cartridge case rim sticks out of this gap, making the action air-tight and sealing the action. After firing, the barrel is rotated down and you grab the big cartridge rim with your fingers to extract the case. Folks have realized that plastic will work just/almost as good as brass for the cartridge case and costs much less. They also don't need to cleaned after each firing.
Rich
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Todd Birch
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Rich
How would you rate the Smith as compared to the Maynard? It has the virtue of using readily available rubber cartridges.
If either one ever crosses my path, I'll have to have it. There's just something about Civil War carbines.....
The Brits did extensive testing of almost all of the American designs, including the 1855 Sharps slant breech which didn't make the cut due to gas leakage. Burned too many fancy Dragoon uniforms! ....."whatever would the Queen think?".....
Of all designs, they saw merit in the Terry carbine which most US authorities considered a turkey.
Todd
How would you rate the Smith as compared to the Maynard? It has the virtue of using readily available rubber cartridges.
If either one ever crosses my path, I'll have to have it. There's just something about Civil War carbines.....
The Brits did extensive testing of almost all of the American designs, including the 1855 Sharps slant breech which didn't make the cut due to gas leakage. Burned too many fancy Dragoon uniforms! ....."whatever would the Queen think?".....
Of all designs, they saw merit in the Terry carbine which most US authorities considered a turkey.
Todd
"From birth to the packing house, we travel between the two eternities ....." Robert Duvall in "Broken Trail"
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gmartin
- Posts: 361
- Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 9:55 pm
- Location: Boise Id
Rich,
Once again I printed this out for it's great historical and current information. I have in my minds eye a mental picture of this gun but I see I really must find a real image.
As with Todd, I am into the mystique of Civil War Breech Loaders, esp. carbines. Got to admire recently an original Spencer in mint condition, as nice as my replica '63 carbine nearly, my brother bought for just $300. I admired it all the more for it's heavy Sharps like feel. He gave it backed when asked to do so by the auctioneer, but that's another, (sad, sad) story. After he'd bought everthing to convert it harmlessly (all original parts could be retained and replaced) to center fire.
Thanks, Gregg
Once again I printed this out for it's great historical and current information. I have in my minds eye a mental picture of this gun but I see I really must find a real image.
As with Todd, I am into the mystique of Civil War Breech Loaders, esp. carbines. Got to admire recently an original Spencer in mint condition, as nice as my replica '63 carbine nearly, my brother bought for just $300. I admired it all the more for it's heavy Sharps like feel. He gave it backed when asked to do so by the auctioneer, but that's another, (sad, sad) story. After he'd bought everthing to convert it harmlessly (all original parts could be retained and replaced) to center fire.
Thanks, Gregg
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Rich Siegel
- Posts: 610
- Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2002 7:53 am
- Location: Maine
Todd and Gregg,
For a view of the Romano 1st model Maynard Jim and I are talking about, look at www.romanorifle.com Romano has also started production on the 1882 Maynard rifle in modern calibers (45/70 and more to come). My only complaint about his rifles is that his wood to metal fit is not the greatest ( Boy Scouts fitting wood with dull pocket knife) but he is getting better. His prices are high however. See his web site.
The Smigh carbine is a very good shooting carbine. As good as the Sharps however it's stock is straighter and I just can't aim correctly with a Smith while a Sharps fits me correctly. Some people think I'm just strange!
The Smith is easy and fast to load, a little bit easer then the Sharps to clean and can use brass, rubber or plastic cases to shoot. Most shoot the Lyman 515 mold casting a. 425 grain bullet while others like a lighter bullet from Rapine molds. Several of my friends shoot original Smiths and do as well as I with my Shiloh. Just depends how your like your cup of tea. At least with the Smith, you don't need to make those darn paper cartridges!!!
Rich
For a view of the Romano 1st model Maynard Jim and I are talking about, look at www.romanorifle.com Romano has also started production on the 1882 Maynard rifle in modern calibers (45/70 and more to come). My only complaint about his rifles is that his wood to metal fit is not the greatest ( Boy Scouts fitting wood with dull pocket knife) but he is getting better. His prices are high however. See his web site.
The Smigh carbine is a very good shooting carbine. As good as the Sharps however it's stock is straighter and I just can't aim correctly with a Smith while a Sharps fits me correctly. Some people think I'm just strange!
The Smith is easy and fast to load, a little bit easer then the Sharps to clean and can use brass, rubber or plastic cases to shoot. Most shoot the Lyman 515 mold casting a. 425 grain bullet while others like a lighter bullet from Rapine molds. Several of my friends shoot original Smiths and do as well as I with my Shiloh. Just depends how your like your cup of tea. At least with the Smith, you don't need to make those darn paper cartridges!!!
Rich
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Todd Birch
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Maynard and Smith Carbines
Thanks for the site info!
Gotta get one or t'other, in .50 so I can use the same bullet I'm using n my .50-70.
Took my .50-70 Shiloh Military Rifle afield today, one half hour from where I'm sitting now. Found a group of five does but it's a bit early for the bucks to be about.
Later, Bambi, later....I know where you live.
Todd
Gotta get one or t'other, in .50 so I can use the same bullet I'm using n my .50-70.
Took my .50-70 Shiloh Military Rifle afield today, one half hour from where I'm sitting now. Found a group of five does but it's a bit early for the bucks to be about.
Later, Bambi, later....I know where you live.
Todd
"From birth to the packing house, we travel between the two eternities ....." Robert Duvall in "Broken Trail"
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Todd Birch
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PS: to last post.....
Rolling paper cartridges for my Shiloh .50 calibre '63 became a lot simpler once I discovered .54 calibre Pyrodex pellets.
I simply roll a lubed Lyman 515141 with a 60 gr Pyro pellet in a suitable piece of paper and I have an easy loading, authentic looking round that handles well.
Accuracy is all I need for hunting and it isn't too shabby on paper either.
Todd
I simply roll a lubed Lyman 515141 with a 60 gr Pyro pellet in a suitable piece of paper and I have an easy loading, authentic looking round that handles well.
Accuracy is all I need for hunting and it isn't too shabby on paper either.
Todd
"From birth to the packing house, we travel between the two eternities ....." Robert Duvall in "Broken Trail"
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gmartin
- Posts: 361
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- Location: Boise Id
Rich, and Todd,
I don't mind rolling paper cartridges, even enjoy it. Fits into a flytying mentality.
Great info on the Maynard and the Smith. Some time back in Black Powder Cartridge, "The Buffalo Range...", Leo Remiger writes of a variety of Civil War era Maynards, I see the protruding case as you mentioned Rich. He includes pictures of disected cartridges. Haven't checked out the web site yet but I will, wanted to write first.
In the same issue, Spring 2004, an article, "The Hunting Trail" has a man on an accuracy search using a Rifled Musket and a Smith, both originals. The Smith was problematic and required the same amount of attention as any BPCR gun to shoot accurately, but he had 3" groups at 100 yd. Great reading.
Thanks, Gregg
I don't mind rolling paper cartridges, even enjoy it. Fits into a flytying mentality.
Great info on the Maynard and the Smith. Some time back in Black Powder Cartridge, "The Buffalo Range...", Leo Remiger writes of a variety of Civil War era Maynards, I see the protruding case as you mentioned Rich. He includes pictures of disected cartridges. Haven't checked out the web site yet but I will, wanted to write first.
In the same issue, Spring 2004, an article, "The Hunting Trail" has a man on an accuracy search using a Rifled Musket and a Smith, both originals. The Smith was problematic and required the same amount of attention as any BPCR gun to shoot accurately, but he had 3" groups at 100 yd. Great reading.
Thanks, Gregg
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gmartin
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Rich Siegel
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Gregg,
My personal take on the Keen and Walker is that unless your a die-hard Confederate, it's a rather crude gun. No disrespect to Larry Romano, that's just the way they were made. Really, if you get the urge for a CW period carbine other then a Sharps, get a 1st model Maynard. Though they look strange without a forearm, they are the most accurate, easiest to clean and easiest to shoot. The short throw, center hung hammer really helps offhand shooting as does the tang sight.
Speaking of Confederate CW carbine, about 10 years ago, Shiloh produced a Robinson carbine, built on the standard '63 gun but with a brass barrel band and a simple Kentucky blade rear sight, just like the originals. Kirk, do you still have parts to make a few? Would you consider making a new one. I'd rather buy a new one from you then try to find one on the used market.
Rich
My personal take on the Keen and Walker is that unless your a die-hard Confederate, it's a rather crude gun. No disrespect to Larry Romano, that's just the way they were made. Really, if you get the urge for a CW period carbine other then a Sharps, get a 1st model Maynard. Though they look strange without a forearm, they are the most accurate, easiest to clean and easiest to shoot. The short throw, center hung hammer really helps offhand shooting as does the tang sight.
Speaking of Confederate CW carbine, about 10 years ago, Shiloh produced a Robinson carbine, built on the standard '63 gun but with a brass barrel band and a simple Kentucky blade rear sight, just like the originals. Kirk, do you still have parts to make a few? Would you consider making a new one. I'd rather buy a new one from you then try to find one on the used market.
Rich