MVA, Baldwin, Kelly or?

Manny Clothakis · Post by **Manny Clothakis** » Fri Jan 30, 2004 6:51 am

Need help deciding which site to buy for my Shiloh #1 sporter 45-70. I would like as many opinions as possible to educate me and make the right decision. I realize that these sites all have good and some not so good qualities but need your opinions. I think I have made up my mind that the front will be the Balwin vs the MVA - it's the rear that has me going nuts, oh, should I opt for the long range for a few extra bucks or get the mid range

Thanks, Manny

Dave Shaw · Post by **Dave Shaw** » Fri Jan 30, 2004 8:53 pm

Manny clothakis

I've got to say I go with Steve Baldwin's. I have them on both my rifles (Pedersoli Sharps & Winchester Hi - wall, 45/90's) the long range will get you past 1000yds and they are easy to read.

Outrider · Post by **Outrider** » Fri Jan 30, 2004 9:24 pm

I've gone with the Baldwin front globe. I have'nt handled the others but the Baldwin is very well made. They include an aluminum tool that you insert in the spirit level hole (without the level in there of course) and hit with a hammer to drive the sight into the dovetail. Easy installation and no marks on the sight. I chose the Kelly soule sight. There was no place for me to view and handle these different brands around where I live so I had to choose based only on what I could read. One thing that steered me to Kelly was their use of silicone beonze bushings for their adjustment screws as opposed to lead. The sight just plain looks good too! Adjustment knobs are brass, and the staff is color case hardened (at least it appears so). I hear lots of good things about MVA and, again, I've never had an MVA product. I'm sure they're good also. I went with the mid-range rear sight because I can only shoot out to 500 yds. around here. My next sight will be a long range however. Whatever you do, don't scrimp on the sights.

Ken Hartlein · Post by **Ken Hartlein** » Fri Jan 30, 2004 11:01 pm

I can't say enough good about Ron Heilman's tang rear and globe front sight. I really think his front globe with "Skylight" and internal sprit level is the best in the business. You can get both of his sights for less than the other guys tang alone will cost you. Ron is a lifelong machinist and makes the sights one at a time himself.

Sharpsnut · Post by **Sharpsnut** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 4:37 am

Steve Baldwin is a master machinist in his own right as well and builds his own sights ,too.They are not the cheapest Soule rear sights made nor are the the most expensive,but IMHO,they are the best.

They are slightly beefed up in key areas to keep them tight and the windage barrels are tight and yet work very smooth.Steve's sights are hand fitted and it shows.Many folks only pick a sight by the name recognition of the Brand or based on a lower price.

If you talk to many folk who have USED every type of Soule sight out there(las I have) the Baldwins are recommended most often.The only gripe some may have is the windage knob works the opposite way ,but if you learn it that way to begin with it's not problem..... :wink:

Manny Clothakis · Post by **Manny Clothakis** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 7:45 am

So far, as I see it, the Balwin front site is a no brainer, most seem to favor it and the rear is also favored. Please keep the advice coming regarding these sites. The Kelly sure looks pretty but will it stand up to the others?????? Manny

Smokin · Post by **Smokin** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 8:31 am

Manny,

Yet another really fine tang sight is the one made by Kermit Hoke of Kermitool, Inc. He is also a shooter and makes a sight in the style of, I believe, the ones used on the Hepburns. It is not a Soule style sight in that it does not have a windage drum, rather it has a double vernier scale for windage that works to each side of zero and slides in tiny dovetailed ways with a gib to adjust tension and take up any wear. I find it faster to read and repeat than the Soule style sight. There are also holes drilled in the edges of the elevation and windage thumbscrew heads which correspond to 1/2 minute adjustments. It comes with an adjustable aperture (5) eyecup that has an O-ring cushion around its edge. And the staff comes with elevation markings on both right and left sides.

It's a good sight. Check it out at: http://www.kermitool.com/ or call Kermit at(717) 846-8665. Good luck, Smokin

ps, Ron Heilman's front sight is very nice too. It mounts lower to the barrel than the other fine internal level sight, the Baldwin, and it takes the Lyman 17 inserts which give you a greater choice of what to look through or past.

Outrider · Post by **Outrider** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 8:42 am

What I am about to say I can only base on my experience with this brand. There are many shooters out there who have experience with the other brands and can offer valueable advice to you. The Kelly soule tang sight is well built and durable. The only thing that I would (and someday will) change would be the eyedisk. The Kelly comes with an eyedisk that is period correct (I hope I'm right on that). Anyway, it has 5 different aperatures. The aperature size is changed by moving an aperature plate that is mounted in the middle of the disk. Kind of hard for me to explain in writing. As my fingers are kind of big it's a bit difficult for me to change the aperature size with this eyedisk. From what I have seen the Hadley eyedisks from MVA have a knurled thumbring on the outside of the disk that you simply turn to change the aperature size. Also there is a rubber ring around the Hadley eyedisk which is supposed to protect the stock from being scratched when the sight is folded down. The only other bad thing that I can say about the Kelly soule sight is that it is one of the more expensive ones out there. Good luck and enjoy your shooting.

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 12:07 pm

I own several and have tried others. They are all top of the line sights and so is the price. I will say that my top pick is the Baldwin sights on the front and rear. Steve Baldwin is also one great person to talk to.
Frank Costa

Post by **Kirk** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 12:31 pm

Hi Manny, the two choices for quality are Baldwin or M.V.A. bottom line. They are both great sights and we have mounted both. You have to decide if you want a classy looking sight like M.V.A to put on your nice rifle or a big heavy un-breakable baldwin sight (both great sights). I have been shooting for a lot of years and have mounted every one of these sights that these guys are telling you about and I wouldn't even consider any of them except for #1--- M.V.A and #2--- Baldwin, end of story!!! Thanks Kirk

Bill Falk · Post by **Bill Falk** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 3:18 pm

Howdy, I add a BIG ditto to Ken Hartlein's post re: Heilman's sights.

Kenny Wasserburger · Post by **Kenny Wasserburger** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 6:11 pm

I have looked at them all,

Played with about 4 or 5 makes. My thoughts echo Kirk's MVA #1 Baldwin #2.

I must say that the Hoke maybe another good sight, from What Frank M and others say about them I have yet to see one in person.

Kenny Wasserburger

RMulhern · Post by **RMulhern** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 6:21 pm

I've had my "belly full" of Soule sights! Today...I spent half a day overhauling 3 of 'em! Won't say what make...these guys are just trying to make a living so no use "bashing" anybody. Actually I've got 4 sights that needed reworking but I won't send it off until Monday. It's still under warranty so I'll let them fix it....hopefully! I don't think it's possible to make a Soule sight that will stand up for any length of time without it getting slack in the cross-feed and then.....you've got the staff moving side to side because of "slop"!

My next sight will be a MVA 107 Long Range Vernier. No slop to worry about as it's "fixed" in design! I'll put an adjustable front on and that will solve the problem of a limited amount of movement on the #107. But at least I won't have to be "fighting" the slop that I have encountered with these Soules!

Gunny · Post by **Gunny** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 7:03 pm

This site thing comes up from time to time, and as usually there are about as many different opinions and reasons why as there where before. It is kinda like the powder wars just site wars instead, next week we are going to have a wad war.

I own way to many site's, and way to many different brands. Of all of the sites i own my favorite is one that is no longer made, but had some unique features and I just love that site. MVA builds in my opinion a very good site maybe the best out there today. Steve Baldwin builds a site like a tank and almost as heavy, I have only one of Steves sites and never use the thing, I simply don't care for the backward turning windage adjustment and trying to remember that it is opposite of all my other sites is a pain so it sets in the safe unused. I personally love a soule type of sight, for Silhouette they are superior I feel for this reason I would not consider one of Hokes site's, I have seen them and they appear to be a very good and serviciable sight. Then there is the Kelly, I own one of these wish I didn't and thats all I have to say on the Kelly. If I was out to purchase a new site today I would choose an MVA Buffalo Soule without a doubt. It is as good as any sight on the market maybe better. The folks at MVA do a lot to support all of us shooters with give aways and such. They support us I am going to support them.

Gunny

Omaha Poke · Post by **Omaha Poke** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 7:46 pm

Kirk, one question. If you are so sold on the MVA sight, why do you continue to put that almost impossible to use and read sight on your LRE rifles, both fron and back? The globe and post front without interchangeable inserts and the rear tang that is not repeatable, should not be put on these rifles. I have two of them (sets) that I replaced with and MVA and a Kelley Soule. Bothe of these work great. Cut the dovetail and leave it empty and let the customer either put on his own tang or have you put it on, but don't put those unuseable ones that people have to replace.

No disrespect intended.

Randy

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