Claude Dallas

[buffalocannon]

This is WAY off topic but my curiosity is killing me, and I thought I would attempt to pick a brain or two. I was at the range the other day shooting my Shiloh with another Shiloh shooter from up north. He started telling me about this man Claude Dallas who was some sort of a mountain man with an antique Winchester who murdered a couple of game wardens about 20 years in Idaho or Montana, was convicted and imprisoned, and then escaped from prison and was supposedly never heard from again. Is this a true story? Is this guy still on the loose? What happened to him?

[Ray Newman]

I just did a Google search for "Claude Dallas" .

There are several hundred hits for this "escapee".

Didn't bother to look @ any to determine if it's fact or fiction....

[ironramrod]

buffalocannon,

I remember part of the Claude Dallas story. Mr. Dallas was a long line fur trapper at the time when pelt prices were exceedingly high (late '70s and early '80s). During this period prime pale colored coyote pelts were often selling for $150.00 or higher each; prime well spotted bobcat pelts were often selling in excess of $500.00 each. Needless to say we're talking big money. Also, most states had season limits on bobcats. However, with those kinds of pelt prices the temptation was there to ignore the limits especially if one was in remote country.

Anyway, Mr. Dallas was trapping in the area along the Idaho/Nevada border; lots of bobcats and coyotes in that country. The local mocassin telegraph reported that Mr. Dallas was taking large numbers of bobcats illegally which very well may have been the case. That is quite remote country to say the least; not many yard lights. Apparently, Mr. Dallas was a suspicious and somewhat hot-headed type so he always carried a large caliber revolver with him almost everywhere he went. Mountain man? maybe. Poacher? a definite maybe.

Idaho F&G sent 2 wardens into the area to locate him, check licenses/ cat tags, and determine if he was obeying the rules. Apparently the 2 wardens came on really strong with Mr. Dallas, and during the course of the field investigation Mr. Dallas pulled out his revolver and shot them both dead. After a long manhunt he was captured, and sentenced to prison for the 2 murders.

He apparently did escape from prison, but I don't know what happened after that. Others may be able to fill in the blanks after he escaped from prison.

Regards

[Buckskinner]

Buffalocannon

Ironramrod has the story correct. The two game wardens were slaghtered by a worthless piece of humanity who was stealing from all honest people of this state.

The two game wardens consisted of a senior officer and a junior officer. The senior officor had a reputation for being a little heavy with his authority and many people thought Dallas should have been acquited. The junior officer was just in the wrong place at the wrong time a terrible act on him.

Dallas was sentenced to life in the state Pen. he escaped and was recaptured at a later date and is in prison. I have been told he is in a revolving prison system because he is a excape risk.

IMO he should have gotten worse

Gary

[Todd Birch]

Canadian country and western singer Ian Tyson did a song about Claude Dallas that painted him as a misunderstood anachronistic folk hero.
I can't remember the title or the name of the album.

Kind of reminds me of the Idaho Ruby Ridge incident. Were any charges ever laid against the FBI shooter?

Todd

[ssdave]

Gist of what has been said so far is correct, buckskinner has the final disposition right. I grew up in this same back country, in the same culture that Claude lived in, in that time period, and have some personal knowledge of the people involved. Locally, Claude was a folk hero. He was hid out by some of the local folk, who saw him as a friend and co-defender of a vanishing way of life, and saw the law as meddling intruders applying urban, east coast resource regulations in an area where they didn't fit. It gets a lot more complicated than that, but this isn't a political forum.

The only reason Claude got life instead of acquittal is that he mercy shot both men in the head at short range after he put them out of commission in a fire fight. The jury felt that the final shots showed some malice or depravity, where otherwise the defense had effectively shown self-defense. The local mailman was a witness to the incident, and he testified that the senior officer pulled a gun and said "this time we're taking care of you, Claude". Claude had been cited numerous times before, but was somewhat of an anti-law protestor that felt he had a right to take plentiful game in a remote area while he semi-subsisted off the land. As I recall, the poaching he was apprehended for was venison, not furs. Anyway, Claude beat the law to the draw, and put both men down. As gary said, the junior officer was in the wrong place at the wrong time, with a dangerous and out of control partner. The senior partner had a record for instigating violence against non-resisting and sometimes innocent perpetrators. I have personal knowledge of one such incident. Anyway, all this was brought out in trial, and Claude got life instead of death row.

The culture hasn't changed all that much in that area in the last 30 years. This is essentially the same area where the "Northern Nevada Shovel Brigade" is fighting a war with the Forest Service over closure of a 2 track jeep trail. If you haven't lived and worked there, it's hard to really understand how poor a fit Federal land use regulations are to the people who claim this country as their home.

dave

[Todd Birch]

Good Post Dave

Tyson's song has a line about Dallas "...havin' a right to hang meat this far from town...".

Sounds like a good ol' boy that shoulda been left alone.

Todd

[Bill C.]

I was on my way to a Deer hunt in the mid 80s and was on about a 70 mile long gravel road that runs along the eastern rim of Steens Mtn. and the western edge of the Alvord Desert in S.E. Oregon.

I stopped for gas at the tiny "town" (a single building!) of Fields (Station), Ore. and the old timer who came out to pump gas for me (the building was the original late 1800's one with the addition of a couple of gas pumps and a cement pad) said, "You'll never believe who came by here and gassed up yesterday? Claude Dallas!" He seemed downright pleased that Dallas was still on the lamb and not caught.

I can't remember if this was before he was originally apprehended or after he escaped.

He was well known in this area as he seemed to have lived and travelled the tri-state area of S.W. Idaho, N.W. Nevada and S.E. Oregon equally. Oregon LEOs were looking out for him as he'd lived/worked on the Alvord Ranch before and Fields would have been within his area of operation.

It was all over the news for a long time up here and everybody knew about it at the time.

There was speculation that he was up in this area as one possibility. I think I read that they found that he was living in a trailer court in Riverside, Cal., clean shaven with shorter hair. I think they apprehended him at a convenience store when he went there to shop.

[Josh A.]

Execution of innocent men doing their jobs. Yep, sounds like a good ole boy to me.

J

[TYRVR]

Thats the thing about "Folk Heros"....not all "Folk" see them as heros.... all my Heros shoot Sharps....not cops.......now if this was the "Cop Killer Heros" site........would you expect or tolerate a post about sight settings for 535 Gr. bullets using CTG...?
now....anyone have any funny Hitler storys?

[Josh A.]

Hey, maybe Kirk will link the site up to the beheading video! Why them are just some good ole boys, that kid was just in the wrong place at the wrong time!

J

[A.Bruiser]

I've read about Claude Dallas. Interesting story and some viewpoints put forth here. Matter of fact had an uncle who got into a personal fight with Claude and gave him what for. My uncle was a poacher to, only thing was he poached to feed his family, not make a profit.

It looks like some guy's expressing their views and then someone comes along and say's that shouldn't be done, as in TYRVR, this topic is under shooter to shooter, so wouldn't that mean you can pretty much talk about anything? Now you want to talk blackpowder, there's a heading for it and you want tech support, looks like one for that to. My question is, what does it matter, what's talked about here on shooter to shooter? Looks to me like there's plenty of places to talk on Rifle's, powder and so on. So now why go and step on someones toes like that?

Don't like it don't read it!!!!

A.Bruiser

By the way C. Dallas got his just rewards, almost.

[Todd Birch]

When all is said and done, one man's hero is another man's bum; one man's Freedom Fighter is another's terrorist. It depends on whether you win or lose, stay free or hang.

How would you describe Jesse James or any other of the famous western bad men? Guess it depends on which side of his gun you stood. How about the buffalo hunters? Were they heroes to the plains Indians or the worst scum on the face of the earth?

The founders of your nation were traitorous dogs to the British and had you lost the war, the Brits would have gladly hanged every one of them.

Every signer of your Declaration of Independence paid dearly for it. They lost their lands, families and had their lives utterly destroyed.

Winners, losers, heroes, bums .......history is written by the winners.

Todd

[TYRVR]

I was also expressing a "view"........if the board is open to views about cop-killers....shouldn't it be open to those who shoot at stuff other than cops? if you want to write or read about criminals and murderers.......there are a myriad of sites, there is only ONE Shiloh rifle site. I suggest you take your own advice about reading posts......

[Josh A.]

Perfect example of the moral relativism. The REAL difference between a hero and a murder, terrorist and freedom fighter is the morality of their conduct and cause. The terrorism we see in the world today is NOT fought for freedom, they fight to keep oppression in place. A hero fights against evil and does not target women and children, a terrorist kills cruelly and indiscriminately.

The ability to see and understand the objective difference between good and evil is the plague of our time. We are going to pay a heavy price for it.

J