Shortening barrel for offhand shooting

[TexasMac]

I’ve been doing a lot of research on shooting offhand since it’s the main limiting factor of my scores. I’m seriously considering shortening my 1874 Sharps .40-65 barrel by 4” (30” to 26”) & taking 1” off the stock to reduce the length of pull due to my relatively short arms. Shortening the barrel will reduce the overall weight & will move the rifle balance point closer to but still slightly forward of the forearm location where I hold it with my left hand. Since I use a scope, reducing the sight radius is not a major concern, but it will likely reduce the muzzle velocity a bit. My current loads result in a muzzle velocity of 1270fps. Can anyone offer an educated guess on how much the velocity will drop?

Wayne

[martinibelgian]

Suggest you also put some weight in the buttstock in order to get the balance point at or behind the hand position on the forend - that's what greatly contributes to offhand rifle stability. And the change in MV will be IMO negligible, certainly with a cartridge like 40-65 shooting a heavy bullet with moderate loads.

[stevewhr]

Seems like a bad idea to me. I'd work on my offhand technique instead.

[Luke]

What stance do you use for off hand?

[Clarence]

I think most people prefer the longer barrel. Should you ever decide to sell it, shortening the barrel and buttstock will certainly make it less desirable...

[Don McDowell]

Seems like a bad idea to me. I'd work on my offhand technique instead.

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[40-65rl]

Seems like a bad idea to me. I'd work on my offhand technique instead.

This is a very good off hand shooter. Wayne you saw him shoot in Texas.

[powderburner]

Wayne. Probably incur the wrath of all on here.
I too suffer from short arm syndrome and find that I can shoot a shorter barreled rifle just as good as a long one. I don’t feel handicapped at all with a 26 or 28 inch barrel. And I have a couple rifles I cut the stock down on and find I can get into the scope a lot better than my longer barrel rifles.
I admit I have no trophy’s from anything but I do know my rifles quite intimately. They ride with me in my truck daily.

[TexasMac]

Guys,

I’ve been shooting BPCR silhouette for 25 years & have tried several variances to my stance & rifle holding method. To aid in improving offhand shooting, 3 yrs ago I bought a PCP (Pre-Charged Pneumatic) pellet rifle of approximately the same weight as the Sharps & setup a range with appropriate reduced size targets behind my house. Since then I’ve sent thousands of pellets down range. The results with the Sharps vs. the air rifle has convinced me a large part of my problem is the forward weight of the Sharps during offhand shooting. The balance of the air rifle is much better than the Sharps

I agree with martinibelgian’s comments that the balance point of the rifle should be at or behind the hand position on the forearm. Taking 4” off the barrel would move the balance point to my hand position & should have relatively little or no impact on prone shooting. And as I noted earlier, I’m a scope shooter so reducing the sight radius is not a problem. And I’m not concerned about affecting the resale value.

BTW, I called Lucinda at Sharps this morning to discuss having them do the work. Since shortening the barrel would remove any choke I asked her about it. There is a common misconception that Shiloh chokes their barrels, which Lucinda said is definitely not true. None of their barrels are choked.

Wayne

[martinibelgian]

THe balance point position definitely is a big factor for offhand shooting, not so much for prone with a support. But my best offhand rifle by far is my 45-70 which balances, you guessed it, just a bit behind the hand position on the forend. Barrel would be about 26". Now, my 32-20 is configured the same, but I haven't yet used that one offhand.

OTOH, my prone rifles are dedicated prone rifles, and shooting them offhand is an exercise in frustration for me - beause of the balance point being way too far forward and the buttstock being too long: a buttstock for prone shooting should also be longer than one for offhand.

You don't have to believe me, but your scores will suffer. Remember, beauty follows function - I prefer a rifle a bit more ' stubby' that does the job over a rifle that is a p*g to handle and will make your scores suffer. Beauty is NOT the most important factor, practical accuracy is. If you can do the job by just adding weight to the buttstock, all the better. If not, by all means lop off a bit of barrel. The weight reduction will not be al that big, but it will be where it counts - way in front Remember, the weight is not the issue, it's the point of balance which will really help rifle stability. That, and the fit of the rifle, of course. No amount of practice will overcome the disadvantage of a rifle that's too muzzle-heavy.

The only way to shoot accurately with a rifle configured differently is by using a pronged buttplate and a palmrest - but I gather silhouette doesn't allow that. Pretty sure Wayne's offhand shooting will benefit from the modification, given his practice with the air rifle.

[SSShooter]

Wayne - what is your barrel contour at the moment? Heavy, half-round or what. Rather than making shorter I would have it turned down in order to take out some weight towards the muzzle. I know of at least three shooters who have done so and retained their 30" length and are pleased with the result. Suggest you try that first before cutting any length to <30".

[Woody]

Several years ago, I built up a Winchester High Wall in 45-70 with a 28 inch barrel and a balance ever so slightly aft of my forearm hand. Made no difference in my offhand scores or my stick scores.

My best offhand chickens, (9 of 10) was with a .40-65 High Wall with a too long length of pull and a 32 inch barrel. My two other 5 in a row chickens were with a 45-90 Ballard sporting a 34 inch barrel and a Shiloh LRE 45-70 also with a 34 inch barrel. November at Friendship, I broke 6 or 10 chickens with my High Wall 45-70 and a 32 inch barrel. The common denominator, apparently, is the long barrel. Hmm. I also have shot four, (this year) and five chickens, several years ago, with a standard unmodified trapdoor.

Your technique is what makes the difference. Concentrate on getting that "surprise break" not the latest offhand specific rifle.

Woody

[jackrabbit]

Seems like a bad idea to me. I'd work on my offhand technique instead.

Mangle your rifle if you like, it's a free country, but it ain't gonna change your scores one bit. The way to improve your offhand skills is to improve you, not chase changes in your equipment. Besides, I like my rifles heavy and barrel heavy. I want them to teeter on my support hand, which is supporting the rifle right under the trigger guard and my left elbow is resting on my ribs. I hold the butt of the rifle down with my right thumb which is wrapped around the wrist of the.

If you really want to improve your offhand, you need to do a couple of things. First, improve your strength. Get you a dot on the wall of your basement/office/TV room whatever and hold on that dot in your offhand stance for extended periods of time. If you do this everyday, you will be surprised how quickly you will soon easily hold on the dot without wobbling and also for a long time. When I was practicing hard, I could hold on the dot for over 30 minutes without feeling fatigued. If a shooter cannot hold steady offhand, it is because they are not strong enough. After you get so you can hold without wobbling for a couple minutes, then start practicing your trigger press. Work on squeezing the trigger without moving the sights off your dot. While doing this, also concentrate on your follow through. Personally, I believe poor trigger pulls and lack of follow through are the biggest causes of misses in our sport. Stay looking at your target as you pull the trigger! One is never going to consistently hit anything while snatching at the trigger as the sights fly by the target.

The final point that most shooters agree with, but few do anything about is to develop a mental program. We have all heard shooting is 90% mental, but how many of us practice the mental? Not many, that's for sure. Get a copy of Lanny Bassham's book "With winning in mind" read it and do what it says. After you have developed the strength, you have to get your mind to focus and concentrate when you need it to.

I also find little shooting an air rifle to help little in improving your BPCR game. The rifle is just too different, the trigger is different, the rifle balances different, etc. The best practice is to either get a 22 that is identical to your big bore rifle, or use a liner in your big bore rifle.

I intend for this post to be helpful and not overly critical Wayne, but you also need to look at who advice is coming from. The above advice is from someone that can go toe to toe with any other offhand shooter in the country. My advice and tutelage has also helped several other shooters that have become excellent offhand shots.

To answer your original question, I don't believe going from 30" to 26" will hurt velocity as much as one might think. My bet would be around 30 fps. Somewhere I have seen data to support this, I'll have to dig and see if I can find it again. I had a Sharps in 45-70 with a medium weight barrel that I cut back to 26" for hunting. Velocity was not off by much. It totally changed the feel and character of the rifle and never liked it after I did that to it.
Merry Christmas!
Cody Smith

[Don McDowell]

Still think it better to build up another rifle with the shorter pull and barrel length
If it works then you can sell this one if it don’t then you can sell the Frankenstein rifle
But one thing is for certain once you start cutting chunks off you can’t put them back
Cody gave you solid advice

[SBR4590]

I've been shooting BPCR since 1992. In the early days I couldn't miss if I wanted to. These days when I get to chickens, between my internal shaking and lack of strength, no change in barrel length will give me any advantage. good luck to you.