Sorting .22LR Ammo

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TexasMac
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Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by TexasMac »

Since most of you big bore shooters also compete in .22 BPCRA matches I thought you'd be interested in the following:

In a recent article in Guns & Ammo on the benefits of sorting .22LR ammunition Dave Emary came to a few conclusions. Dave is Hornady's Senior Ballistician. To make a long story short, he concluded that measuring rim thickness is the least worthwhile sorting method. Based on his experimenting the most significant factor is bullet runout (concentricity), and bullet head height being the next most important.

It should not be a surprise that runout is a contributing factor since sorting for runout is a common technique with high power precision shooters, but it’s not typically associated with rimfire ammo . He noted that he’d never heard of measuring .22 ammo head height which is the measurement from the base of the cartridge case to the top of the bullets driving band. It’s an interesting article. Since I have all the necessary gauges including a RCBS concentricity gauge I recently completed measuring 15 cartridges of several brands.

As expected, the more expensive ammo was better than the cheap stuff. But there were a couple of surprises. I expected the cheap Win Wildcat to be worse than the data suggested & was a little surprised to see how well the RWS R50 turned out. It was no surprised that the Win. bulk plinking ammo was the worst of all the stuff I have.

Although Dave’s article I mentioned there’s little or no value in sorting by rim thickness, it’s easy to do. And based on other articles, weighing .22 ammo is not considered beneficial, but I was also curious. Determining head height was quick using Hornady's bullet comparator with .22 insert.

Measuring run-out (concentricity) was by far the most tedious measurement. Concentricity gauges are made for larger cartridges. I was able to use my RCBS Case Master Gauging Tool but it took some practice to develop the necessary technique due to the small size of the cartridge. Setting up the spread sheet, entering all the data required a good bit of time, but was necessary to utilize the statistical calculations. I was not about to do it using a hand calculator.

Overall this exercise was very time consuming. I did it out of curiosity & have no plans to continue sorting .22 ammo. And I do not plan to test fire the sorted ammo. BTW, I shoot the CCI Std. Target for the chickens & pigs, the Eley Match for the turkeys & rams.

Wayne

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Coltsmoke
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by Coltsmoke »

I shoot exactly the same ammo for the same targets that you do. I agree with some of the statements and disagree with some of the statements made here. The expensive ammo that I have measured and weighed had very little difference and when testing the different groups of the ammo it made no difference in accuracy. The cheap ammo that was sorted did make a difference in accuracy. I did a weight test and started with the lightest weight of the ammo first, then the next group was a half grain heavier and so on. The heavier the weight the better it shot, then I reached a weight that it started opening the group back up. The weight that shot the best was great at 200 yds. The rest of the box of ammo was not good enough to use in a match. It was not worth the time and money to get 7 rounds out of a box of 50 to use in a match. Just buy good ammo and be done with it.
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TexasMac
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by TexasMac »

A sharp guy on the ASSRA forum spotted a couple of errors in the spread sheet due to my use of the wrong correcting factor for the bullet comparator gauge. Following is the updated & corrected data.

Wayne

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40-65rl
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by 40-65rl »

Years ago when I first got into lever gun silhouette I asked folks who I knew were pretty darn good at the game about .22 ammo accuracy and they told me to check the rim thickness to determine good ammo. They told me the headspace is determined by rim thickness. I measured hundreds of rounds and found that most cheaper ammo was not as consistent in rim thickness as the high priced spread. Then it became the rage to check the weight of the ammo so once again I followed the yellow brick road to the weighting ammo land of Oz. I painfully weighed hundreds of rounds and separated them. Shot them on paper and didn't really see any big difference between the very small weight difference. Lately been asking my friend Michael Jackson to check the concentric of the .22 ammo we shoot, Lapua. He has the device and checks a box at a time rather than just a few rounds. We look at lot numbers and check against that also. I recently obtained several bricks of the new Lapua Long Range and Super Long Range .22 ammo and shared it with Steve Anderson and Michael Jackson. I asked Michael to check the concentric on a box of each of the new Lapua Long Range and Super Long Range., we share the same lot numbers. His checking indicated half the box of Long Range was .001 or less with a few at .002-.004. The Super Long Range had almost all at less than .001. The velocity on the lot number says it is 1080 not the advertised 1106 on the Lapua web site. He had a brick with a different lot number and the velocity was listed at 1105. Different lots so watch the lot numbers for the velocity you want, just like the Eley Match. Steve Anderson shared a U Tube video from Eagle Eye Precision testing the Long Range and Super Long Range. His testing gave the Long Range and SD of 7.3 with velocities in high 1070's and low 1080's. The Super Long Range had an SD of 7.8 with the same velocities as the Long Range. At 100 yards his best group, using a Vudoo precision rifle, shot outdoors in Arizona was .228 with the Long Range and just slightly larger for the Super Long Range at 100 yards. Steve Anderson and I shot several different Lapua ammos at the Cheyenne Rifle and Pistol Club outdoor range last week. The result of this test, all targets at 200 yards, out of a Benchrest house off bags, using our .22 BPCRA rifles, his a C Sharps and mine a CPA are posted on the .22 BPCRA Facebook page. Steve and I shot the new Lapua at the recent Smithmoor match, He shot the Super and I shot the Long Range. He stumbled a bit on rams and I ran the lay downs with about 3/4 inch on the pigs. I really think the real test is shooting on paper, just as my good friend Kenny Wasserburger has told me on many occasions. Bottom line, shoot what performs in your rifle in the conditions.
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by bpcr shooter »

Wayne,

Is there a way you could do the SK long range match ammo?? I and a few others have had really good results with that ammo and it would be interesting to see.

Thanks,

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TexasMac
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by TexasMac »

bpcr shooter wrote: Wed Feb 15, 2023 2:22 pm Wayne,
Is there a way you could do the SK long range match ammo?? I and a few others have had really good results with that ammo and it would be interesting to see.
Thanks,
matt
Matt,

My 1st thought was to decline for two reasons, I don’t have any SK Long Range & have no desire to locate & purchase ammo to test for others. And it takes about an hour to setup & test 15 samples & document the results. Then I thought, since I’d like to try SK, if Matt will send me a couple of boxes of the ammo it would help justify the time. :D What do you think? Let me know.

Wayne
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by bpcr shooter »

Im sure I could spare a couple boxes for the cause.


Pm sent....


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John Bly
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by John Bly »

I just sorted 1000 rounds of Eley Match Black. 989 rounds were within +/- .2 grains. 11 rounds were more than .5 grains different. Would these 11 rounds have caused misses at 150 and 200 yards? I'll never know because I'll shoot them up somewhere else. Just my experience and my take on it.
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Woody
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by Woody »

I gave up sorting and decided to just pay the price for the best. I can't shoot better than Eley Tenex. The only sorting I do now is to insure that the lot number of a box that I open in the middle of a match, is the same lot that I started the match with.

Woody
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by SSShooter »

I weigh-sort anything less than Midas+ or Tennex. As John stated above, with Center-X or Match there are 10 or more out of a brick that "could be" flyers. Why risk it?

Never did rim thickness so got the Hornady parts to do so. Total waste of $/time on the ammo mentioned above. Same with Norma Match and Federal Gold Medal Match 922A. All were <0,002" deviation.

However, weigh-sorting the Norma & Federal went into five lots. Still not as good at 200yd as the good Lapua or Eley. They cost more for a reason.
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by Geologist »

Weighting 22 caliber LR cartridges is a waste of time. I sorted a brick of high-end 22 by a 1/10 of a grain. Then I took 40 of the same weight and took them apart. The weights of the bullets, brass and priming compound, and then powder were all over the map. I believe the the velocity that one's gun likes is more more important. To make a long story short, I went to a 100 yard indoor range with a variety of measured velocities / lots. Starting with 1060 F/S average velocities, I tested boxes / lots in 2 F/S intervals to 1080 F/S. The pattern was open, then closed-down to under an inch, and then opened-up again. That rifle seems to like1073 F/S regardless of the lot. Now I just buy that velocity.
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by TexasMac »

Matt (bpcr shooter) sent me a couple of boxes of SK Long Range .22LR to sort by dimensions. Following are the results of a sample of 15 cartridges. If you compare the results to the data reported earlier in this thread the SK really looks good & is on par with Eley Match. Rim thickness essentially matched one of the Eley Match lots and Run-out is the best of all the ammo I tested. I'm looking forward to testing it in my Stevens 44.

Wayne

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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by VectorMan »

Glad to hear that about the SK long range.
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TexasMac
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by TexasMac »

BTW, ignore the Eley Match heading on the SK Long Range data. I missed deleting it when using the same spread sheet format for the SK data. The data is definitely for SK Long Range not Eley.

Wayne
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jackrabbit
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Re: Sorting .22LR Ammo

Post by jackrabbit »

While you fellas are busy spending copious amounts of time weighing, measuring, sorting, and generally obsessing over minutia, I will be practicing. Let's meet up this summer and see who comes out on top? Alrighty, see you then! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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