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paper patching troubles
Posted: Sun Sep 10, 2023 10:50 am
by JonnyV
I've been trying to work out wrapping bullets. Been doing it with Seth Cole 55 paper wet with distilled h2O and rubbing alcohol mixed 50-50. Tried drying the bullets overnight, then in the oven, then on a coffee warmer. The wraps always seem to come undone.
I've seen some video of guys wrapping using fingers coated in bullet lube, similar to resizing brass. Have any of you tried this? Any other tricks to wrapping bullets?
Thanks!!
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Sun Sep 10, 2023 11:31 am
by Coltsmoke
Add just a little liquid coffee creamer to plain water, dry on coffee warmer.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Sun Sep 10, 2023 11:50 am
by JonnyV
dairy products help patching?
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Sun Sep 10, 2023 1:33 pm
by martinibelgian
The issue usually is the foldover at the base, if not enough it will become undone. Still if you put it in the fired case after patching,no problem.
I patch dry, no issues unless the foldover is too small. And that really isn't an issue if the bullet is in the case, and a snug fit. After all you don't want the paper to stick to the bullet.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Sun Sep 10, 2023 5:55 pm
by monkeyboy
I dry wrap mine then run them through a sizer bushing. They don't come unwrapped. FWIW.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2023 6:13 am
by bpcr shooter
How much do you fold over the bottom of the bullet? I have a bullet that has been sitting on my shelf for years....dry wrapped that has never come, un-wrapped.
matt
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2023 10:04 am
by JonnyV
bpcr shooter wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2023 6:13 am
How much do you fold over the bottom of the bullet? I have a bullet that has been sitting on my shelf for years....dry wrapped that has never come, un-wrapped.
matt
Messed around with it for a while last night. Found out that the heat works really well to keep them from unwrapping. Getting the same overlap on the base every time helps too...trying for what looks like a shy 1/8th inch...
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2023 1:46 pm
by Coltsmoke
You will not make the paper stick to a bullet with a touch of coffee creamer in a cup of water. Try it before you already know the results. That is how a lot of BS about this sport gets started.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2023 2:45 pm
by JonnyV
Coltsmoke wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2023 1:46 pm
You will not make the paper stick to a bullet with a touch of coffee creamer in a cup of water. Try it before you already know the results. That is how a lot of BS about this sport gets started.
I didn't mention anything about paper sticking to the bullet, I was just surprised that dairy would help...lactic acid, animal fat, and some natural sugar...gotta think on that one...
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2023 6:12 am
by bpcr shooter
over lap the bottom about what you are doing now, and just dampen the base. Then set it in a ctg box to dry out. They should stay in place for a bit.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2023 8:37 pm
by mike herth
Another issue is the patch itself. How critical is it to have the edges perfectly meet without any overlap or space? Rolling patches is tedious and fatigue soon sets in. And is there a sweet spot for how far up the straight shank to patch? To the ogive or how far below? I patch for a 45-70 and use 1" wide patches using 3 different papers. Seth Cole white seems to work best with my .446 bullet, dry patched without running through a sizer. I'll try wet patching over the winter and see if that makes a difference. I get a flyer regularly with 5-shots at 200 yards and wonder if it's related to the patching. And I wonder about the effects of inconsistent neck tension even though I seat only about .15" deep.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2023 8:51 pm
by semtav
mike herth wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2023 8:37 pm
Another issue is the patch itself. I get a flyer regularly with 5-shots at 200 yards and wonder if it's related to the patching. And I wonder about the effects of inconsistent neck tension even though I seat only about .15" deep.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say it probably has nothing to do with the way you are putting the patch on.
Maybe the thickness of the patch or overall diameter of the finished patched bullet, the case prep or the bullet alloy but if you are doing a reasonable installation of the patch itself, I doubt that is your problem.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Wed Sep 13, 2023 10:30 am
by craneman
I dry wrap my bullets several days to weeks before I load, usually while watching TV/Movie. I place them in these delrin loading trays from Brownells. After a few days the patch base is almost ironed on. If I peel the patch off the foldover marks are imprinted on the base of the bullet. I have also dry patched bullets and stuffed them into the loaded cases sitting in the camper the night before a match. Pretty quick, simple, and repeatable once you get the hang of it.
Todd
https://www.brownells.com/reloading/mea ... ng-blocks/
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Wed Sep 13, 2023 8:32 pm
by Coltsmoke
Mike I'm guessing here, but I would look at fouling control as a cause of your fliers, especially the last two inches of the barrel.
Re: paper patching troubles
Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2023 2:07 am
by martinibelgian
mike herth wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2023 8:37 pm
Another issue is the patch itself. How critical is it to have the edges perfectly meet without any overlap or space? Rolling patches is tedious and fatigue soon sets in. And is there a sweet spot for how far up the straight shank to patch? To the ogive or how far below? I patch for a 45-70 and use 1" wide patches using 3 different papers. Seth Cole white seems to work best with my .446 bullet, dry patched without running through a sizer. I'll try wet patching over the winter and see if that makes a difference. I get a flyer regularly with 5-shots at 200 yards and wonder if it's related to the patching. And I wonder about the effects of inconsistent neck tension even though I seat only about .15" deep.
My experience, and only mine:
- a bit of space is better than overlap
- You ideally patch up to where the bullet shank expands, otherwise the lead in front of the patch could expand and give leading. In the other case, the paper won't be cut completely, which isn't good for the paper release. How to know? study fired bullets. Finetuning by alloy hardness or patch length. Less an issue with PP bullets patched to groove diameter.
- I prefer dry patching, IMO less chance of paper sticking to the bullet.
But always a good idea to try and recover fired bullets to see what needs to be done>