Iron or scope class

[From Along The Trail]

I am wondering if these glasses would be legal to use in BPCR competition.

There are 2 lenses in the holding tube. I obtained a set of pre 1900 ophthalmologist set of trial lenses. As I was recovering from vision problems. I was just figuring out ho to use them.

And then this happened.

[From Along The Trail]

This shows another angle and extra lenses for the glasses.

[SchuetzenDave]

A single lens or diopter lens is allowed in air rifle, small bore, ISSA and ASSRA competitions however two lens are a telescope and means you would only be allowed to do it in scope events.

NRA BPCR rifle:

Sec. 3.4 (b) Rear sights will be of a vernier or ladder type, typical of the era, either open or peep, mounted on the tang or barrel. No modern style receiver, GLASS, or tube sight permitted. Front sights must be typical of the era, and may be shaded. No modern or Olympic-type sights permitted.

[steveu834]

One lens in the frame of the glasses in order to see the front sight clearly is all that is required for irons.

IMHO,
Steve

[From Along The Trail]

With this trial set of lenses, you can put two or three together to gat a specific power. A .25, .50 and 1.0 would get you to 1.75 correction. Either positive or negative.

So this part of the subject could disqualify me from iron sight class?

Although they are not attached to the rifle.

The other thing that helps is the quality of the lens itself. These are glass, and probably of good quality. Also testing different lenses in different times of the day, it can make a difference. Or if it is cloudy or clear.
I am trying to do things as could be found in the 1870’s or later. Since I was having vision problems, these helped to see better as I was recovering.

With the lenses set in the tube, it could possibly be called a shadow tube. Just like on a period scope, of the time, could have.


In my experience with my prescription glasses as what the ophthalmologist says I need for general use, is just that they are not the best for seeing a target at long distance.

With this set, I have the ability to change to the correction as I need.

Just something to think about.

[steveu834]

I have 3 pairs of Junkers rifle frames. 2 are set up for iron sights, one is a +1.5 diopter and the second is +1.75 diopter. The third has a slight distance correction that I use for scoped rifles. I would recommend that you get a pair of glasses just for shooting. Most regular frames will not put the correction where it should be for shooting.

Cheers,
Steve

[Tomklinger]

Magnification is magnification doesn’t matter if it is several lenses in a scope or several lenses in your glasses on your head!! The shadow tubes you refer to have no magnification! Ive seen your rifle in person at Riverbend and I’m really not sure what you are trying to do. It’s a double barrel shotgun made out of parts with a .45 cal. liner in one barrel which to me, would make it a cape gun. Not sure where it fits in BPCR. Trust me, Clubs are letting you shoot out of kindness, I wouldn’t try to bend the rules too much. Scope is scope, iron is iron with NO multi lens magnification…
Maybe you could buy BPCR rifle that is legal under the rules of our sport and come join us and have some fun!
Tom Klinger

[From Along The Trail]

I want to explain some of my shooting experience, from the last few years.

I just went back through my medical records from my two ophthalmologist. I started getting chemo shots in both eyes in September 2020. Early December 2021 just before the date to get more shots in the eyes. I tried seeing through my scope tube. At 55 steps, looking at a 2” orange target, I had to put a .200 inch rear opening on my scope tube. Just to see that target
Not a fun experience. So I would get a shot in one eye, then the other, say two minutes apart. If I am going to be miserable, two shots are not much worse than one.

Dec 18th 2021 was the last time I had a chemo shot in either eye.

I visited a long range shooting competition about June 1st 2022. I was not there to shoot, just a spectator, to see how they do a match. It took some time, but I finally could see the target at 700 yards. But I could not see the 1000 yard target.

I can now see a 12” white square @1000 yards, that is on a dark brown 6’ square, if the sun is shining on it in the early morning. Without glasses.

I can see that target through my scope tube with my prescription glasses. Since I had those lenses from the trial set to test my vision over the last couple years. I was just holding two lenses up, and found a positive 2.50 lens along with a negative 3.50 lens corrects my vision at a long distance. Better than my prescription glasses.

The next morning that it is sunny at 8 am. I will try test this duel lens glasses at that white target. If they work better than my prescription glasses, I will use them to gain more experience at practice. If I go to a match I will shoot with what they say I can.

I

[From Along The Trail]

I want to explain some of my shooting experience, from the last few years.

I just went back through my medical records from my two ophthalmologist. I started getting chemo shots in both eyes in September 2020. Early December 2021 just before the date to get more shots in the eyes. I tried seeing through my scope tube. At 55 steps, looking at a 2” orange target, I had to put a .200 inch rear opening on my scope tube. Just to see that target
Not a fun experience. So I would get a shot in one eye, then the other, say two minutes apart. If I am going to be miserable, two shots are not much worse than one.

Dec 18th 2021 was the last time I had a chemo shot in either eye.

I visited a long range shooting competition about June 1st 2022. I was not there to shoot, just a spectator, to see how they do a match. It took some time, but I finally could see the target at 700 yards. But I could not see the 1000 yard target. With my prescription glasses on.

I can now see a 12” white square @1000 yards, that is on a dark brown 6’ square, if the sun is shining on it in the early morning. Without glasses.

I can see that target through my scope tube with my prescription glasses. Since I had those lenses from the trial set to test my vision over the last couple years. I was just holding two lenses up, and found a positive 2.50 lens along with a negative 3.50 lens corrects my vision at a long distance. Better than my prescription glasses. I have no idea how that works?

The next morning that it is sunny at 8 am. I will try test this duel lens glasses at that white target. If they work better than my prescription glasses, I will use them to gain more experience at practice. If I go to a match I will shoot with what they say I can.

I

[marlinman93]

Hey, at least you're still out there trying to shoot! A lot of guys would give up and sell all their guns in the same scenario, so good for you for sticking in there and still shooting!

[semtav]

Come over and shoot gongs with us. We'll let you use those funny things.

[From Along The Trail]

The sun finally came out.

So I set up a test scope tube, same as on my rifle. It was just before 9 am when I did this test.

I can see the 1’ square target, that is on the back of a 6 square brown board. At 1000 yards

With both eyes naked. Left eye is 50 percent of the right, shooting eye.

With prescription glasses, I will say 60 percent better. Makes it smaller and sharper in focus

With my homemade glass fixture and a positive and and a negative lens, maybe 70 percent.

This does need more testing. As I have three different sets of trial lenses.



I will say I cheated on my drivers license. Did not have one for two years. Because I figured I would have trouble passing the eye test.

[SchuetzenDave]

You actually do not need to see well to shoot accurately.

I had very bad cataracts and managed to still be the International Schuetzen Benchrest Champion (50 shots irons & 50 shots scope).

I could only see a fuzzy target a third of the time with my iron sights but still managed to score the highest iron sight scores with top shooters at the ISSA Nationals.

As Lones Wigger (Olympic Hall of Fame for Shooting) advised me your eye will properly center a fuzzy target and sharpening the focus on the target is not important.
What is more important is having a sharp front sight with a fat aperture ring so that your eye uses it to center the fuzzy target.

Many people do not know that balancing the right amount of light with an adjustable rear aperture is how you focus and sharpen your front aperture.

If you have a sharp target and a sharp front sight your eye keeps changing it's focus back and forth from the sight and the target.

With a sharp front sight and a fuzzy target your eye stays focused on the front aperture and will center the target better without changing it's point of focus.

Even after cataract surgery I still adjust my sights so the front sight is more prominent to my eye than the target.

This has reduced my iron sight groups to a third the size after I quit the procedure of trying to have a sharp target picture.

[From Along The Trail]

Dave
I must say that what you just explained, makes a lot os sense. And will help greatly.

Thanks, Vern

[SchuetzenDave]

So many people feel they need to decrease the aperture size on their Hadley disk so the target fills more of the space.
That is not the purpose of the adjustable aperture Hadley disks.

The more light the eye receives the better it is able to focus and center the target in the front sight.
The wider the aperture the more light is available to the eye which is the best scenario.
To a point.
If you get too much light then you get glare on the front sight.
Then you go back to a smaller aperture to eliminate the glare and you have the best light to have a sharp front sight picture.

Many people use a 9 aperture Hadley disk.
I have found to obtain sufficient light at dusk, cloudy or rainy days, or early morning I need additional larger apertures which are available in the 15 aperture Hadley disk.
I have been able to keep shooting Rams in darker periods when the other shooters were no longer able to see the target.

With Schuetzen I am also able to use a diopter as well.
After adjusting for the correct amount of light I focus the diopter until a sharp target is obtained.
Then I back the adjustment so I only have a sharp front sight but the target is no longer sharp.