Raton Bits and Meanderings

Kenny Wasserburger · Post by **Kenny Wasserburger** » Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:23 pm

Raton meanderings.

Some may know but for those that dont:

Brad Rice of Col won the nats.

Top guns included Steve Brooks, Butch Ulsher, One new guy that I cant remember his name, Kenny Durham, Al Sledge, Mike Rix, Matt Carter, Jerry VanWay just to name a few also Dave Gullo. Top score was a 94 I think>??
thats the Irons of course. These guys had some great spotters, Gene Davids was shooting with Butch, Kenny Durham does most of his own, Steve Brooks and his wife Gail, and Al Sledge had Kelley Roos as his spotter. I think Brad's wife is Debbie? I am not sure who was spotting for Jerry but I think it was Bob Grider, Gunny would know for sure. Dave Gullo had John Venhous spotting for him. Mike Rix I think had Sherrif Woody spotting for him, I think David Barns was spotting for Matt.

Scope Nationals was fun too I shot it also, and enjoyed it a great deal more then the irons which I shot very poorly in on the first day.

Top Gun Was Brain Chilson of PA with a score of 100/120 a new national Record.

#2 gun was Steve Garbe with a 99/120

Scores were impressive to say the least, Brain was using a 45-90 BTW!

Steve was shooting a 38-50 so it shows that 38's do well, Steve did mention that on day 1 he used the entire pig to get his 15/15 pigs. Again this had alot to do with Steves abilty to shoot and Spot well above the avg Shooters abilitys, Steve also rung one Ram. One has to wonder if he had shot a 40-65 if he would of not been the National Champ? Steve and I had quite alot of vists, as we usually do, Wyoming Outlaws tend to stick together! However Steve mentioned a very interesting point to me, IF no weight limit was imposed on Silhouette, he would have a 22 lb rifle, built up in 45-110 as he feels it is one of the most accurate cartridges in the BPCR game. He just cant stand the recoil. Steve made one other good point that a new shooter is much much MUCH better served with a 45-70 or the 40-65 as a silhouette caliber. And this I agree on totally! A 38-50 or a 45-110 is not for the NEWBEE in this game. And they wont win you a national Championship! Its my contention that these type of calibers are for the expert BP Shooter and while they Deliver alot they are harder to make work then the more forgiving 40-65 or 45-70. Steve also offered me the use of his 3-50 chamber reamer as this cleans up my 38-55 chamber and my 1-14 twist barrel is the same as what Steve uses. IT is a thought!

My own shooting while not national champ level was not to bad 38/60 the first day and 36/60 the second. One Day one I got my 15/15 pigs and had an Excellent Group on them with the scope. My shooting pard for the Scope nationals was Richard Bement of Centinial Co. Richard was 3rd Overall in AAA class with a 76/120 I believe? It was his best nationals yet and I think he was pretty pleased with the spotting, at least that was what he was telling folks! my own 74/120 did not even place in the top 10 so thats how tough it was and I too had an excellent spotter. Scope is here to stay as a National Event, we had nearly 90 Scope class shooters, with over 90% of the scopes on the line MVA and those that were not MVA scopes many were using MVA mounts. My own scope is the Mil Dot reticle and I like it very much, the Trend is once sighted in on the swinger to use hold off's to contend with windage changes, this seems to work very well. My scope was set up as MVA reconmended and 3 tic marks on the elevator are equal to 1 MOA of adjustment. The MVA scope is of such quality that I could keep an eye on the mirage in my own scope while shooting.

It would seem that since my first iron sight match this year was Raton that I may need new glasses. We got rained out on Wed afternoon and I had to finish my last animal on Thur morning. Burms were wet and very dark. I had to shoot Turkeys, but was able to get 12/15 to somewhat salavge my lousy scores. Jim Gier again mention the Fact that my Postell Bullet just does not drift much and does an excellent job of bucking wind. All 3 of my misses where called high shots and just over the turkeys back. This is an original postell bullet design unlike the current Lyman Bullet. It is loaded to over 1230 fps with Goex Fg and weighs in at 518 grs. My favorite front sight of the Pinhead was retired, and I went with a narrow flat post. Will see if new Glasses can bring back my use of the pinhead in the front sight.

Highlights of the match for us, were my shooting pard Jim Gier's scores, JC shot well day one with a 40/60 and ended as 10th AAA in Match #1 (mon and Tues). This was even with a broken firing pin, that I raced off while he got his alibi and I did a quick teardown and put in a New Firing pin, A dirty breach block was the culprit, I always carry Spare pins. JC got an alibi and shot his 3 banks of Rams at the end of the day.

Match #2 was a 36/60 for Jim and he ended tied for 9th overall in AAA class. We had a rather tough conditions for the shoot off, low light and hard to see and wind, but Jim pulled out and won and ended with 9th AAA Class. Conditions were not real bad this year but lot of subtle wind changes that really were moving the shooters bullets around. One thing many folks missed, but quite a few caughtt on was that a tail wind was not pushing the bullets up as on most ranges but was driving them down, of course this depended on what part of the range you were shooting on.

Jim's last bank of Turkeys on Wed was shot in very high winds with a change in windage of 5 points and elevation of 3.5 points, many shooters and spotters missed this call and had a really bad last bank. It was switching so fast it was hard to keep up with. And was a real lesson in spotting. Raton is a good range to learn on and makes for some real lessons.

My long range was a wash this year as Krystal came down with a real bad migrane Wed morning and while feeling a bit better, I brought her home on Friday morning to avoid her having to put up with two days of heat and sun while I shot Creedmoor.

As always Raton was fun, many friends I see only once a year at Raton. The Bakers for one, Larry Sr, JR and the Grandson. A new National Sub JR Champ. Dave Crossno is another, Doug Lyle and many others, David Cook who I vist with alot but only see at nats. Bless you David, now that you have a 45-90 barrel you have seen the light!

I spent double duty spotting on all 4 days of the iron nationals. And this was a bit tiring for me to spot for 2 then shoot, Next year I am going to spot for 3 folks on one day and then just shoot by myself the other day, make it a bit less tiring. That way on the one day Dan and JC can fill in spot for Krystal some and let my eyes rest. I also plan on shooting some Silhouette matches next year before Raton!

For those of you that missed Raton, well All I can say is you missed out!

See you all there again next year!

Kenny Wasserburger

Kelley O. Roos · Post by **Kelley O. Roos** » Sun Aug 08, 2004 6:11 pm

Brad Rice won Irons sights with a score of 97, I don't remember the name of the man who was second with a 96 and Al Sledge was third with a 94, tied with Steve Brookes and won the shoot off.

Matt Carter's spotter was Tom Berwick and Matt shot a 91 (I believe) Jerry Vanway had a 92 and Bob Grider spotted for him.

To get in the top ten in master you'd had to of shot an 87 or above, it was that tough.

A man named Mike something from Kanas (I believe) shoot an 82 to win the AAA class. I'm not sure who got what after Mike's win.

The weather conditions were the best I've ever seen, hotter then normal, except for one wednesday afternoon, which I want to forget. Those weather conditions contributed to the higher scores. Raton had been getting some needed rain in the afternoons just before I arrived and then good weather held for 5 and half days. All in all Raton this year was great.

The competor's meeting, for iron sights, went very well and some needed changes will be made to the Raton range and maybe some other issue's as well.

The scope meeting went well also, there will be some changes in the scope rules as well, will have to see next year what they change, the changes will be postive and help eveyone.

Mid-Range prone was won by Klus (shittzerbergin, have no idea how to spell or pronounce his last name,sorry Klus) Ray Hansen was second, Butch Ulsher was third, those are the Agg. winners.

Mid-Range position was won by Al Sledge, second was Steve Baldwin and for the life of me I can't remember third, senior disfunction on my part.

Can't comment on Creedmoor as I had to head home for work tomorrow. I wanted to see some new country on the way home instead of blasting home as I usualy do after creedmoor on Saturday. My wife and I with some friends saw some nice Az. country side and had a lesurely drive home. I may even have found some property to buy above the Mogollon rim area in Az.

Kelley O.

bpcsman · Post by **bpcsman** » Sun Aug 08, 2004 7:41 pm

Jim Dietlein from Michigan was the name of the person you cannot remember.He is a very fine shooter from here in Michigan and this was his second time at Raton. I know it is pretty hard for you guys to remember a guys name from East of the Mississippi but there it is ,and I am sure it may come up again.He and Brian Chilson both did a fine job of representing us easterners and bringing home some of the bacon so to speak.
I am sure that Brian is very proud of his scope championship.He came very close to winning I believe in 1998 in the match but lost to Steve Garbe in a shootoff for the title. Congratulations to them and all the fine shooters that were there.Sounds like you all had a very good time.

Kenny Wasserburger · Post by **Kenny Wasserburger** » Sun Aug 08, 2004 7:44 pm

Thanks Paul!

its not that it is hard to accept that it is just not common! And heck I remembered Brians name!

Congrats to Jim I will remember his name now!

Kenny Wasserburger

RANGER RICK · Post by **RANGER RICK** » Mon Aug 09, 2004 1:06 pm

Thanks kenny and all involved to keep us updated .

RR

James M · Post by **James M** » Mon Aug 09, 2004 1:13 pm

How many wins were scored with Shiloh's ?

Dave Shaw · Post by **Dave Shaw** » Wed Aug 11, 2004 6:54 pm

Hi Guys

Just to let you know that having done my first Raton, and still doing the last week (week 3) of my first trip to the US. I'm having a ball

the shooting was very informative, as we don't have silhouette in England. (This is beeing worked on, the set up in Raton has been looked at carefully)The Mid range and Creedmore were all challenging shoot's, the average summer temp's in England are in the low 70's so the 80 - 90's

of Raton took some geting used to.
Having now got a grading - A class

my scores next time might get me some where. Very glad to get 3 chickens over the two days.
All the 'big names' were there, all were very modest people who had plenty of time to talk, despite what ever else they were doing.
I must thank both Steve Baldwin, who hosted me and provided reloading facilities(no black powder on international fights) and Ross Burson from Channing, Texas who was my spotter, with out him I would not have got the score I did.
For all of those I met and those who gave so freely their advise I am greatfull.

Regards

Dave

Kelley O. Roos · Post by **Kelley O. Roos** » Wed Aug 11, 2004 7:06 pm

Dave Shaw,

You forgot to mention the sun and contact lense's. Did you get the chance to head down to Cimmeron to see and get some picture's of that Buffalo herd

.. Which way did you head after leaving Raton and what airport are you leaving the country from

Want to tell what you think of the mountains and the size of the USA

I, for one, am glad you made it.

Folks, everytime I saw Dave he had this big grin on his face and I think he slept with it.

Thanks for the Sheep, Dorene obscounded with it

Kelley O.

Dave Shaw · Post by **Dave Shaw** » Wed Aug 11, 2004 8:33 pm

Kelly,

The contacts lenes have been sorted out - never let your eyes dry out.
did'nt get time to see the Buffalo at Cimmeron, so that's for next time.
I travelled up to Denver from Raton, a three hour drive, am now getting used to the distances. I am now in New Orleans (flight down)untill Saterday, when I fly back to Denver and pick up my rifle and things. Fliying back home on Sunday.
Have done more miles in two weeks than there are from the most northly point in mainland Scotland to the most southerly at lands end. there is no where in England that you can see so wide and so far as you can in the Texas panhandle and New Mexico.
As for the moutains the elivations at both Denver and Raton are higher than anywhere in England.
As for the grin, I still have it and it will remain untill knocked off by my next nationals.

Regards

Dave

MLV · Post by **MLV** » Thu Aug 12, 2004 9:08 am

Dave: It was good to visit with you. See you next year?

Swiss Bob · Post by **Swiss Bob** » Thu Aug 12, 2004 10:35 am

I was glad to see Jim Dietlein do so well at the Nationals. We all know him real well here in Michigan and I think the folks in Pa. recognize his name also. He said he rang a ram and spun a turkey, the two hits he needed to win the nationals.
Along with being an excellent marksman, Jim is a fine unassuming gentleman.
Bob

MLV · Post by **MLV** » Thu Aug 12, 2004 10:43 am

My congradulations to Jim too. Most of us westerners had never heard of him, but we certainly know about him now! Does anyone know what sort of rifle he used, caliber, load, sights, etc?

We know that Steve Brooks was high Shiloh shooter with his .40-65. He was 4th overall, losing out to Al Sledge in the shootoff for 3rd.

Swiss Bob · Post by **Swiss Bob** » Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:07 pm

Jim uses a 40-65 cal. Browning BPCR with a Browning front sight and a Baldwin rear sight. His usual load is 425gr Brooks mold bullet, 3f Elephant powder, and a .060 veggie wad. I know the lead is 20:1 lead to tin. Lube is a mix of Beeswax, lanolin and a vegatable oil. I will ask this weekend what his loads were he is always willing to share his knowledge. He is careful about weighing/inspectiong his bullets.
Seems he can make almost any load shoot, he has won matches here while fireforming his brass. Jim has excellent concentration as an example; last month on the way to the monthly BPCR silhouette match he totaled out his car two miles from the range. He jury rigged his car enough to make it to the match and he shoots and wins the two day match plus wins the lever action match we had as a side match. I would have been a shambles all weekend, he shruggs it off, "what's done is done....let's move on."
He does enjoy the nationals and got a kick out of Dave Gullo and Ernie Stallman congratulating him on his shooting.
bob